Suggest to add salvage bag / similar function.

[Sorceress Adel]

(Original post is located here : http://www.uoex.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3423) I was redirected to here.

Anarchy said it best. The item I was looking to submit a script for or have activated or whatever is called a Salvage Bag.

Like my old post said, the bag deconstructs items as if you had smelted or cut them or whatever. I know you can make a macro and do it 200 times in a row, but that is annoying even if it only takes a minute. This shard/server is so wonderful because of how the staff actually listens to player ideas and makes custom systems.

So, yeah, if possible I would love to submit the item script or request a similar one. I'm trying to do my part as a member, not complain or whine about using mechanics as they are. I paged about this, and was told it was a great idea and I should submit it. Everytime a staff member suggests I make a forum post about my page I do so, even though I havent reached a solution for most of my posts =P

[anarchy]

it's a good idea, but the time it takes to write the script and test the script takes a little longer. i think C's doing a lot right now... but hopefully he'll add this feature.

[Nelapsi]

This script was easy to code for RunUO 2 working with a new client but the older clients have a different packet size for dealing how a menu is created. So it would not be possible to duplicate the bag as it exists in OSI.

So that brings me to what would work, I am open to ideas here.

Simple solution is each craft would have it's own bag and when you put an item in the bag it would chop/smelt the item. If anyone has any better/other ideas perhaps we can come up with a good solution for this.

[Asty]

I think the easiest thing to do would just make something like an ExEx conversion bag, basically using the trash for tokens concept.

Here's how I would set it up:

You drop most kinds of craftable items in, and after a little while you get 5 of the related material in your exex account.

I think 5 is a reasonable amount, and the easiest to actually implement. I mean, sure, ideally you'd get like a quarter, or half, of the materials required to make it, but that would probably mean a lot of actual work. Setting everything to output a flat rate would both be balanced and pretty easy to actually do.

I would also set it up so that you get the material type that the item is made out of. So if you drop in a looted shadow ringmail tunic, you'd get 5 shadow ingots in your exex account.

I'm not particularly stuck on the number 5, either, but I do think it's balanced. The way I see it, 4-6 material is a safe range for automatic recycling of any item. You're going to get more out of, say, a Dagger, but a lot less from Plate Tunics. People who absolutely must get the full smelting value will always go that route, and the rest of us can just get what we get out of it.

If we want to dig deeper into this, you could just go ahead and flat out replace the trash for tokens bag with this. Any valid items would automatically be converted into their materials and deposited into your exex, any invalid materials would be converted into tokens and deposited into your ledger.

That might make it a little bit more complicated on the back end but you wouldn't be carrying around two bags everywhere, and it would be simpler for actual gameplay.

[Nelapsi]

Good idea but this would require +C giving over the code to access ExEx and then perhaps even worse, altering the ExEx in some way in case it is not coded to handle this kind of call. (Short version, not going to happen soon if at all)

In truth there doesn't have to be a bag for each skill, there could be one master salvage bag which will break down items placed in it, then there could be smaller bags of course which could be geared towards items of related material. Kind of like the keys, a metal bag, wood bag, leather bag.

After working with +C on other things I can safely state that the fastest and best route to getting things done is first the code has to be self contained and second not require changes to current systems.

[Asty]

I'm just saying how I'd make it. If you're going to, obviously you can do what you want. If you don't want to touch the exex you could just tie it into an unrelated yet similar system.

Either way, there's zero reason to have multiple bags. The idea is to have less clutter, not more.

As to your last point, well, it seems like there's a lot wrong with the current system, and no amount of patchwork is going to fix it. Some things have to be re-done if they are going to be properly improved.

Fresh pair of eyes, and all that.

[Nelapsi]

Either way, there's zero reason to have multiple bags. The idea is to have less clutter, not more.

I agree and disagree as well. Guess what I am trying to say is I see your point and from an end game perspective only one bag is needed but there are also lower levels of the game that need to be considered as well, like how the bags are acquired (crafted, auction, raffle, bulk order deed reward) A good example of this is like with bags of holding, not many people look at the smaller bag of keeping but they should because it does have its uses. Bulk order deeds also have a flavor of the bag of holding as well, resource bags. So while everyone is rushing for the bag of holding there are some very specific smaller bags that fill niches and much easier to get your hands on.

As I said, I also agree.. does the server/system seen a few different approaches to this solution, not for me to say really. What I will probably do is code them all and let +C make that decision.

As to your last point, well, it seems like there's a lot wrong with the current system, and no amount of patchwork is going to fix it. Some things have to be re-done if they are going to be properly improved.

It is his server and his code, I don't debate the decisions he has made and merely respect them. I was a professional developer before I retired and been involved in runuo coding since beta so I know my way around it, I am just glad he lets me help in the areas he does and leave it at that. Who knows, maybe one he will open up to the idea of a small dev team. I am fairly certain the code sits in a repository so the hard part of that is done.

[Asty]

Like I said, fresh pair of eyes.

You're talking about implementing this to fit within the current system. There's no real reason to do that. When the limitations of old ideas and implementations run their course, it's time to look at new systems.

If I were going to do it, it would, as I said, simply replace the trash bag. There's already enough carrot and stick in this game. More is not only unnecessary, it's annoying.

If you really want me to get going on sweeping changes made with the goal of streamlining, none of the various Keys would exist, crafting materials would simply have no weight.

The only real difference between someone with a pair of keys and someone without it is about 40K and a Gump. 40K isn't exactly hard to come by, and the Gump is just another unnecessary layer in the way of getting things done.

Take a look at spells and magic. We have a vending machine for reagents and a key which can contain all of them. So I imagine someone at some point said: "We should have a way of getting reagents easier, and something to put them in so they don't take up a lot of weight or room."

Perhaps what they should have said is this: "Hey, this whole reagents used in spells thing is kind of 1997ish and we don't really need them for spellcasting at all, especially given the fact that everyone is going to be using 100% LRC as soon as they possibly can anyways."

Sure, you could argue that the reagent vending machine also doubles as a gold sink for controlling the economy, but you're going to be using tons of reagents in alchemy anyways.

Now, keep in mind that I'm not actually suggesting these other changes, I'm merely giving examples as to why trying to force something new and interesting to work with all of the existing system doesn't always give the best result.

[Nelapsi]

That is kind of why I wanted to get other's suggestions and hopefully one or more of them can work within the guidelines I have to code it in because while a salvage bag would be useful for crafting if we had access to the current client and the updated menu packet. However we don't so just looking for new/better ideas that can perhaps be used for this otherwise as I said, I do agree as well.

[Danilo Thann]

First things first, Interesting.

How about first getting +C to allow us the ability to smelt looted items for a fair amount of ingots/leather/boards.

I think a bag would be a bad idea, and find the idea of making or adding a Salvage Page Similar to the [Exex a better idea. The reason a bag would be a bad idea, is because its just more clutter for the server to remember exists. Better to have one social bag, so to speak, then a bag for everyone.

If the page was added I see it working like this: First, addition toggle selection on the far left bottom below 'My Items' and 'My Balance' called Salvage or 'My Salvage.'

Opening this page basically directs the user to a selection of items that can be salvaged, so to speak, in two forms; Normal and Exceptional.

Additionally, item names and totals would also be displayed, plus a return rate. I.E. 11 ring mail armors at 6 ingots of return each.

Salvaging returns should be based off of a characters current crafting ability related to the items specific crafting requirements. This way, its at least fair for both new and old players. A simplistic reward for those who put the time into achieving GM or Legendary status. 'My Salvage' button.... coming soon... (hopes Nelapsi and +C will be able to pull it off)

[Nelapsi]

Yeah, the more I have thought about the "salvage bag" and read posts it is just one of those, fun to code but does not really fit any direct need in that form "idea".

At this moment I have completely walked away from the bag idea and considering perhaps a salvage tool, complete with its own gumps rather then trying to duplicate the bag concept. This may give me a chance to give people a method to handle smelting looted item as well.

While working with exex is not something that will probably happen, I have started considering the idea of making the salvage tool work with the keys currently available in the game. Just running it through my mind and like you said, trying not to make just another hassle.