the new gauntlet

[Locke]

Another question about your question. Is this place suppose to have only a unique purpose?

[Ilsanor]

Newer players will still be able...

The problem is that the Gauntlet was not designed to be a place for newer players in the same way that Umbris was not designed for mid level players. Making gauntlet win for young players will make it suck for everyone else. Good job.
IF gauntlet needs to be changed at all, I'd suggest just cutting the gold drops (by 25-30% for starters) and see where it goes - the point is to keep it as an option as far as farming is concerned but perhaps make it a bit less profitable. I think it'd be really easy to balance it - the GMs making the rounds should just take note of how many people are inside - if it's empty then up the gold since it means it's not competitive. If it's crowded - cut back the gold a bit because it means it's too profitable.

isn't the gauntlet for the purpose of farming an artifact?

Is the purpose of peerless bosses to drop 3-4x46-58's or imp animals? Is the purpose of Umbris/S'gail to do the quests or farm gold/oints?

[Yoda]

just saying my aim when entering the gauntlet isn't gold and never has been..

and yes my aim when doing a peerless is the goc piece/x by x weapons/imps if I was afer gold and oints I have better places to go than that..

[Locke]

I'm able to make million in a very short lapse of time me too and at better place than the gauntlet, but sometimes its a lil bit repetitive you must admit... and if they reduce way to farm gold its a little bit less interesting to play.

And your skipping the real threat ... deflation... i saw you a lot of time defending item high price on world chat( or real price what ever), it's very paradoxal because when they reduce farm spot, they reduce gold new player will spend to buy all your thing... and more and more vet camp spawn and need less and less gears. If you do some math you will understand that making gold now is more harder than 3-4 years before, when this server had less omnipotent vet!

[Yoda]

thats the thing tho locke.. the server may have more vets now (although I think its the same some left some came up etc) but when I joined.. gold farming was still just as rampant as it is now.. it wasn't any less easy to farm gold. the prices were just held in line by people maintaining a backbone about it.. the opposite thing used to happen where sometimes X item would spike by an insane number for a while (10mill goc gems etc) but there wasn't less gold farming, or less goc making they way both were setup Id say there was more..

here is where you and I disagree.. and I mean this perfectly respectably not trying to incite a flame war..

people comparing the shard economy to the real world economy.. are comparing an apple.. to a chainsaw..

if a country in the world economy wants more money.. they go into debt
here there is a virtually unlimited supply of money.. monsters will always drop more
when you manufacture something in the real world.. resources eventually will depleat there is a finite amount of Gas etc

here the mountain or tree respawns the resource

so the real problem is where is thee liquidity in the market when people can hoard both items forever and more constantly is being made..

however this is off topic

the bottom line here is.. it was an old change the lack of gold was unintended to happen last restart they had reconsidered the idea long ago and it went in on a full restart unintended.. so all it takes is a full restart

and the gold is back.. how cool is that..

nothing to worry about just do something else for a few days

Yoda

[+Nyx]

First off, I'd like to ask you +Nyx to stop treating any discussion on changes implemented as a personal attack on you or the GMs in general.

I'd like to ask *you* to realize that me being frustrated at having to make the same announcement about gauntlet 10 times in one week doesn't mean I feel personally attacked. I did not make the change, and other than providing my opinion I will have next to nothing to do with any changes made there in the future. Beyond caring about the shard and wanting the players to be happy, I could give a hoot about what happens with the gauntlet.

True - wherever there's something to be had people will quarrel. But eliminating the gold drops altogether does not really remove the problem - it simply moves them to a different spot.

Which is why we decided not to make the gold change in the first place. I've already explained it was sitting in an update queue and no longer intended to go live. Yet the teeth-gnashing continues as if we on the staff all discussed this and decided it was the best thing and are insisting it's going to stay this way. You can't see why it's frustrating to me to have to repeat myself so many times, even after making a post clearly stating this was an 'oopsie' from Colibri being so busy IRL?

This is a video game, it is not real life - economics are very different here. The prices can deflate for quite some time, while gold still inflates at an insane rate. People are still farming massive amounts of gold every single day because there is an unlimited supply. Prices are lower because of vendors.uoex.net (I wish that would go the way of the dinosaur, personally. A huge part of UO's charm for me has always been hunting through vendors manually for that perfectly priced item), as well as some players ruining pricing or etc. However, truckloads of gold are still being made and held onto. Sometime in the future, the little price 'bubble' is going to pop and suddenly prices will skyrocket because everyone has massive amounts of gold. Then everyone will be freaking out about inflation, not realizing that it's been slowly happening the whole time prices were low. The shard is not deflating because prices are low, this is not a world economy with a finite amount of currency. The shard is inflating while prices temporarily deflate. The staff have to keep that in mind constantly when adding new content, running events, or modifying areas. It is utterly exhausting, believe me. It can suck the fun right out of making new content, dealing with the logistics like that.

Regarding areas like fel wrong, well, again I will point out: They were being abused and exploited for profit far beyond what was good for the shard or intended by the staff. Thus they have been corrected. None of us sat around thinking "How can we infuriate our players today? Let's decrease gold and oints in these areas for no reason whatsoever! Muahahahahaha!" lol

And in response to those saying mid-level players need more to do... well, I think everyone wants there to be more to do for each 'level' of player. I've said dozens of times once my patch goes in V and I have very, very big and exciting plans for new areas. Areas that will be for newbs, for low-to-mid level players, mid-to-high players, and the ubervets. Until then, we do what we can to keep folks entertained - all the while getting yelled at for fixing exploits. -.-


Anyway, I just spoke briefly with Colibri and he is going to revert the unintentional gauntlet change and put gold drops back like originally planned. If there will be other modifications, I am not aware of them yet.

[Locke]

Thank you, i will stop harassing you and other gms about that subject. You have my regard and i have lot of hope in what yours saying for the greater good... i know you took some time answering question troubling us (some player)and its really appreciate... I understand you have a lot of responsability cuz you looks like someone overwhelm by this shard task...( you are the most active gm i ever seen on a shard and I base on what i c, cuz i don't know what happen behind the scene) You need to delegue some task to other people( lesser gm ) and i hope for you that you will have more help in the future

Take care of yourself and good day lady

[Agony]

I remember when there was -no- Fel Wrong, Umbris or SGail.. Ointments went for 8k per and things that cost 100k now cost a million gold. Bio's were not 3 mil, they were 10-13 mil. Wanna talk about hard for a new player to get on his/her feet? Try 3 years ago when when inflation was completely out of control (Items like Gleams -were- added, and to no effect to it). If these adjustments aren't made (and yes, they are live and learn, staff isn't perfect and reverts are often necessary like the gauntlet.. give em a break guys, jeez), this shard will quickly go back to the way it was and new players getting ahead will once again be nearly impossible. I hear alot of new players come in thinking places like Wrong Fel, Umbris and SGail were always here and adjustments to them are considered nurfing the game.. but they're not. These are staff made, custom new areas that are still under development. If I remember correctly, Umbris was not originally supposed to even be a permanent place. It started as an event. Adding these new areas effects the rest of the shard, meaning they make it necessary to make adjustments elsewhere to balance out the whole.

The staff isn't taking -Anything- away from you people. They are simply making it possible to add more substance to your UO playing experience.

[Yoda]

hopefully now you guys can stop tearing our VOLUNTEER staff a new one..

its an ocean, constantly in motion and agony is 100% spot on about it all..

be nice they aren't being paid to take your abuse.

[Locke]

And Yoda I just see some other way, but i respect yours too and Nyx and who ever at the same time

Cheers
Gladly, doing the devil's advocate
-Locke

[Agony]

And Yoda I just see some other way

Since I have been here, many, many and many more other ways have been tried and to little effect. The economy here was not a simple matter of a few quick adjustments. This has been a serious issue to this shard for years. The staff know what they are doing from experience, trial and error, not just ideas or seeing a way. It's really good to see it happening too.. If it means taking something out of the game or closing an area for a couple of months, by all means do it. Anything to keep the shard economy from reverting.

* EDIT *
BTW, when the inflation was out of control, this shard was literally linear, meaning that if a player wanted to get ahead, he/she had only one option in order to advance, I'm talking every new player had to go down the same exact path. No one really crafted.. you did not see much BS or Tailoring items on vendors what so ever. At least now new players have -alot- of options on what to do. Crafting is valuable again, looted weapons are once again being sold. And on top of that, everything is affordable for the average player. This all has to do with adjustments. They're necessary, not -pathetic-.

* One more Edit *
If this thread were to be posted in the Dev thread dept, and people gave -positive- feedback rather than complaints and insults, I'd be willing to bet 500 ed's that the gold would have been returned to the gauntlet by like yesterday.
You catch more flies with honey... I'm just sayin'.

Oh, this post is in no way directed at any single player.. it's nothing personal. Things could simply be on a more constructive note, that's all.

[Locke]

I'm not saying what I thing its better, ok nevermind, maybe your better,
All i care its not about myself, but for other player not compulsive like me

[Larsa]

just saying my aim when entering the gauntlet isn't gold and never has been..

and yes my aim when doing a peerless is the goc piece/x by x weapons/imps if I was afer gold and oints I have better places to go than that..

What a coincidence... me too bro, I just went to the guantlet to try my luck on a BC, SoT, and JC...

I remember when there was -no- Fel Wrong, Umbris or SGail.. Ointments went for 8k per and things that cost 100k now cost a million gold. Bio's were not 3 mil, they were 10-13 mil. Wanna talk about hard for a new player to get on his/her feet? Try 3 years ago when when inflation was completely out of control (Items like Gleams -were- added, and to no effect to it).

I still remember those days man...

[Ilsanor]

Well, I guess I have my answer now. The whole "explain it 10 times over and over" actually comes from Devlin's favorite idea: the changelog. There is no mention of the gauntlet change anywhere on the forums and, frankly, I don't have the time to look through portal for "what +Nyx explained in global". And only in the second answer post did I get the information that it was actually an error and it was going to be reverted. I understood the first answer as: "Yeah, it's an old update that we forgot, but it just got live - it'll stay as it is now until +Coli decides on the proposed changes."

[+Nyx]

Well, I guess I have my answer now. The whole "explain it 10 times over and over" actually comes from Devlin's favorite idea: the changelog. There is no mention of the gauntlet change anywhere on the forums and, frankly, I don't have the time to look through portal for "what +Nyx explained in global". And only in the second answer post did I get the information that it was actually an error and it was going to be reverted. I understood the first answer as: "Yeah, it's an old update that we forgot, but it just got live - it'll stay as it is now until +Coli decides on the proposed changes."

Perhaps that's because until my 3rd post I had not heard back from Colibri with any information regarding what he planned to do. I can't give you information I don't have. My original post was accurate - no modifications to artifact drop were made. My 2nd post was also accurate - at that time Colibri had not informed me what he planned to do, so all I could tell you guys was that it was an unintentional change from ages ago, and that I had suggested various ideas to the boss-man regarding it.

Re: the change log, I can only 'officially' inform y'all of things V or I have changed, and I keep our version of the change-log up-to-date. The "real" change-log is Colibri's domain since only he knows everything he has changed or plans to change. So please do not get on my case for something that I do not have the ability to do in the first place.

Edit: and dangit, I cannot believe not even one person found the easter-egg link in my earlier post!