My gripe...

Adrias · Post by **Adrias** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:39 am

ITT super rich complaining they paid more for things to get it sooner.

the vhs example is actually pretty good. The early vcrs cost 1000s of dollars (and back in the 70s and eariler that was a ton of money). Eventually the prices went down. DVDs came out. The early DVD players cost 1000s of dollars. Eventually the prices went down. Blu-ray came out. The early Blu-ray players cost 1000s of dollars. The prices are coming down now. I don't see tons of people rioting in the streets because the prices of things they bought went down

anarchy · Post by **anarchy** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 5:40 am

It defeats the purpose of the gold sink to sell them a few months later at a lower price. you'd sink more gold if you said "auction only item". because people would pay more = sink more gold.

oh yeah Kaighn; i'll refund your vhs tapes in rl m8. seriously no joke. i have a Wurlitzer 1015 Jukebox a 1953 juke box with all the original vinyls (parents paid couple hundred for it years ago worth 15k now).

arrow · Post by **arrow** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 6:55 am

Maybe if the Grand Auction Item were to have more bells and whistles, or a special color, a special auction plaque, or something that would distinguish it as a grander version of what is later put out for general sale.

TheWatcher · Post by **TheWatcher** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:31 am

Thanks for clearing it up staff, and apologies to +Chaos, it was in no way a stab at you or indeed coli. The economy somehow has managed to stay at more or less the same level for the 2 years i have been here and im sure it has alot to do with the gold sinks from both the auctions and raffles.

My issue is with the fact it may lose the "sink" factor if people know they can buy it at the deco room for 2 mil, im worried people will not spend the 20 mil and the sink will not be as effective.

As far as the VHS analogy goes, your example is flawed. EDs for example I used to buy for 65k a piece. Now they are 40k odd. Im not saying hey i bought all my EDs for 65k, its not fair. The point is I bought what i thought was a unique item, only to find it is worth a mere 2 mil gold. It would be the equivelant of buying a one of a kind VHS copy of "roadhouse" with a signature from Patrick Swayze "which im sure would be worth thousands" only to find the same signed VHS sold months later on ebay for $2.

Adrias wrote:ITT super rich complaining they paid more for things to get it sooner.

the vhs example is actually pretty good. The early vcrs cost 1000s of dollars (and back in the 70s and eariler that was a ton of money). Eventually the prices went down. DVDs came out. The early DVD players cost 1000s of dollars. Eventually the prices went down. Blu-ray came out. The early Blu-ray players cost 1000s of dollars. The prices are coming down now. I don't see tons of people rioting in the streets because the prices of things they bought went down

Again another flawed example we are not talking about mass produced items.

This sentiment is also in my opinion everything that is wrong with the player base of the shard at the moment and why I no longer do the things I used to help younger players out. The whole anti - vet mentality gets me hot under the collar. Why should i or other players be subjected to punishment and scorn for getting to the point we can afford to buy nicer things? In my original post I stated that the only real way to flex our e muscles is to show what gear/auction items/deco we have. There is no PVP to show how awesomernessivity we are. There is no PVP events and whenever someone suggests one, one of the younger players goes on about how we all have to have the same equipment etc cause we vets can only fight with out gear etc, same disrespect for players who have paved the way for you on this shard. You get access to organics, young player champs, rune librarys and scripts and tips written and provided for you by people whom you bag and try to nerf......

Anyway back on topic....

I do get your points Coli and Chaos and thanks for the prompt answer. I get that you are trying to provide a cool looking item for players to have. I wouldnt have got it if it werent so cool

I just think maybe the idea of having a truely unique deco item (different colour whatever) would help with the gold sink and also give us vets who stuggle to find things to strive for, something cool to achieve

My2c
TheWatcher

Omnipotent · Post by **Omnipotent** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 9:59 am

The needs on the one outweigh those of the many??????

Post by **Johnny Warren** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:01 am

With gold so easy to make on the server gold sinks need to be abundant and effective. I think that, as Anarchy and TheWatcher have mentioned, auctions are one of the most effective ways reduce the serious amounts of gold off the server. This means that they need to be protected to some extent. Maybe when "unique" items are sold at auctions +Colibri (or whomever is acting as auctioneer) can state whether or not the item will be an "auction only" item. Or whether in 6 months time we can buy 3 a day at 2mill each...

High end veterans like TheWatcher and Anarchy really don't have much to strive for except obtaining items that show how large their e-biceps have grown... Auctions were previously the main way this was done and as such should have a level of protection....

I really don't want any staff member to feel as if I am directly insulting them or insinuating that they are poor at their job but perhaps some discretion should be shown before making certain decisions relating to creating in game items.

There is a certain rather unique cloak getting around that gives you +1 to all stats. It was given out as a reward for an event. Most events gave you a dated sash or statue (which sell for a couple hundred thousand gold max but players still love to get). This cloak was selling for 50ed+ minutes after it was released to a handful of players. I just think that it wasnt really necessary to put stats onto an event reward item like that, when everyone would have been over the moon just to get a named cloak instead of a statue as the event reward. This is just one example of when perhaps not enough thought was given to the outcome of creating a seemingly harmless item....

As a disgruntled TheWatcher has stated it has also occured with other items in the game...

Well I'm going to end with thanking +c/V/N/Ch/H/J for all the hard work that they have put into this shard over the years and hope that i don't get jailed for this post.

EDIT:

Omnipotent wrote:The needs on the one outweigh those of the many??????

You don't really get it... Yes it's nice to have cool deco items but Auction are here to serve a purpose... I really need an ethy demon mount and i think it should be on the Trinsic gold stone for 2mil... I'm sure there's 50+ players that also need this mount for 2mill off the Trinsic stones... How do you think Anarchy and Nel would feel about that? If suddenly their 2-of-a-kind extremely expensive item became dirt...Thinking of which I need a mountain house and a water house... I think they should both be purchasable for 2-5m.... but then all those people that paid dearly to have a cool unique house would feel ripped off...

The point is that the needs of the many are served by the veterans with oodles of gold buying high end "unique" items at insane prices in order to keep our economy healthy. If it turns out that such items become available easily for pitiful amounts of gold to anyone then nobody will invest in them. Suddenly that poor new player who wants to buy a 120 mining PS is looking at having to pay 35 million gold for it instead of 1 million because the economy has gone out of control. Without a guaruntee of some sort that their item is worht such large chunks of gold then players will stop investing in them so heavily... and the economy runs out of control and we cease to get new players due to this....

Or we could just scrap auctions and put titan's hammers on the gold stone at 25mill a pop. That would keep gold down methinks....

Danilo Thann · Post by **Danilo Thann** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:44 am

Went to the movies the other day. Saw Fast Five for 2 bucks. Yup value cinema for the win. Who ever went and saw Fast Five on opening day, hasn't sent me hate mail yet, though I am waiting and will post accordingly.

Got my PS3 2 months ago for about $260 USD. Bet every one who bought one the first day it came out is mad at me... oops perhaps they are mad at themselves. *shrugs* (wonders what they spent to have one of the first 3 thousand PS3's)

Simple point. When something is one of a kind it has an original value of expensive... but when its initial push has started to evaporate, the price starts to lower itself. SO... this would institute a clear sense of economics. +Chaos made a product, spent his time doing so, and sold it to the highest bidder... later he and his GM family thought it was a good product to continue selling to the public.

Why are we complaining about others having the item... stop whining and just get +Chaos or +Colibri to stop by your house and sign you silly well...

So and So Fancy-Well... Signed by "+Chaos" Issue # 1...

There now you can be recognized for being the first to have something.

In closing... any one can complain about everything... and no one will care... when you start complaining or speaking, rather, about something that can be changed or recognized... that's when people start listening.

Omnipotent · Post by **Omnipotent** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:45 am

Caveat emptor

I dont get it?
The liability here is on the purchaser not the seller!
The buyer read factors into the deal that were never expressed by the seller.

1) What warranty or promise of uniqueness was given upon purchase?
2) What items in the past have been warrantied in such a manner so as to give this purchaser the idea their item wouldnt be offered again in any manner??

I believe its lame to make new cool items for auctions where only the super rich can afford them. Some of the items need to be released later to the general public for purchase. Its only FAIR and will help draw more gold from the economy which is the reason behind the auctions in the first place.

Melkor · Post by **Melkor** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 12:09 pm

I can't believe how out of control this thread is getting, I know its the internet but geez. Between examples and analogies that aren't relevent, to vet bashing and just plain ridiculousness.

C'mon community, lets all be cool and support one another.

Kagan · Post by **Kagan** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:28 pm

Half the people that posted on this wont be happy until whatever a vet buys in auction is immediately sent to thier bankbox for free. Same with what I said in the Champ thread. People will complain until every time a champ spawns everyone on the shard gets a ps automatically even if they were offline. If I buy a one of a kind Rolls Royce for 20 million...then find out a year later that its a replica available for 2 million....yes I am going to be upset. Having said that I cant afford that kind of dough on a grand auction item. Watching others blow that kind of money is downright humiliating to me and my bank account lol. BUT if they paid for a one of a kind item it out to stay one of a kind. Not blaming staff for trying to hurt the auction winners..I just think it was something that never occured to them at the time of release.

Post by **Amberly** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:20 pm

Im not complaining because everyone can afford these nice items, its a grand gesture that people greatly appreciate. Like I said, cool things are EXPECTED to go on sale, get cheaper, ect... So stop talking about your VHS tapes and crap that we already knew was gonna go down in price. The problem is that these items I bid on, I thought were never going to become available to just anyone. I always thought auctions were for collectors who like to have rare items.

TheWatcher wrote: why I no longer do the things I used to help younger players out. The whole anti - vet mentality gets me hot under the collar. Why should i or other players be subjected to punishment and scorn for getting to the point we can afford to buy nicer things? In my original post I stated that the only real way to flex our e muscles is to show what gear/auction items/deco we have.

And as for the people regarding to Vets as being uberly rich people, wow great stereotype. Just because I am a vet doesnt mean im sitting upon mountains of gold and eds staring down at all the poor young players, I am busy in real life and I play only a few hours, if I play at all. Im as poor as anyone else, maybe poorer than you young players, which is why when an auction comes I spend all week getting in as much play time as possible, farming gold and selling anything I have that may possibly help. Now the young complain they cant afford anything at auctions, sorry I dont feel bad for you one bit. If you REALLY want those auction items you will do what I do, WORK your butt off to make the gold. Now that I worked hard for weeks to make this large amount gold and it disappears in an instant for just one single item, I would hope this hard work I just put in would mean something. Months later I realize I worked hard for no reason at all. I get that GMs want to get neat deco out to the public, but the SAME exact item? The auction item couldn't be a special color that no one else can get and the public one a more readily available color? I wouldnt even mind if we did get something simple like a plaque on it saying "crafted lovingly by +Hina", or in the Chaos Well case, I notice the water inside moves and there are lightning bugs. Couldn't The Watchers well be made with moving water+bugs and the public one with still water and no bugs? Simple little details like that would make me happy, something to set my auction item apart from the rest. I spent 12 mil for a vanity to get it "early"....and I can not sit on it, but the public bought one for 3 mil that you CAN sit in. I will page today and im sure the gms will fix it, point is they must touch up or overlook the items again before they are put in the deco since the new one is fixed, cant these little tweakings be done as well during this process?

Cygnus · Post by **Cygnus** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:20 pm

For many players, decorating their homes is a large part of their game. Something to take pride in and to show off. With double lot sizes and custom layouts, the ability to purchase unique items is essential for these players to achieve their decorating goal. As +Colibri so eloquently stated, the staff will create some new items then put them out for auction to see how popular their new item will be. If it doesn't draw much from the crowd, chances are you will not see it again. But, if it is like the wishing well, then they know they have a winner and should make it available to the majority down the road at some point. (By the way, I have a wishing well though I don't know if it is exactly the same and I sure as heck didn't pay any where near 20 mill for it and mine was one of the first ones. I am assuming the 20 mill one must be more elaborate.
Anyways, past experience has taught me that anything sold at an auction will be sold again and eventually again and sooner or later, that very unique items is no longer that unique, regardless if it hits the deco showroom. So, as the one poster stated to begin his comment, Caveat Emptor. The only way to have a high value unique item here is to play long enough and hold on to those event items, food items and perhaps the not so popular deco item that did not sell well at auction.
To make my point one more time, for you auction goers with gold burning holes in your pocket, that item you are bidding on wil be auctioned again at the second auction and then again down the road. Maybe a month, maybe 6 months, maybe be every month but it WILL be sold again. And if it is something that everybody would like to have, look for it to be sold in thh deco room or a stone sooner or later.
I feel for the people who felt they they have been wronged or cheated as I have seen several of my unique items become commonplace today; but I see it as a natural occurance with this type of game play. The funny thing is, I have at least 5, maybe 6 items, that are one of a kind and are probably worth 100 to 200 million gold in todays market yet I spent less than 4 million total. If they ever get duplicated or become commonplace, then I will be a little sad but not upset. It's nice to have something that everyone will want to covet but what makes me so special. Nothing.

anarchy · Post by **anarchy** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 5:23 pm

the VHS wasn't an analogy or a parable or anything. i was asking can i give her a refund. let's see that VHS at that time. what 20 bucks? if in mint/semi mint give to my nephew when he's old enough.

yeah i know if my 1 of a kind sunglasses which i paid 2.25k EDs, and see it as a bonus gift , or something like that. i know how i'd feel. really mad, but eh it's Colibri's house and so i guess it's his rules. now what can i get to be original? any suggestions?

TheWatcher · Post by **TheWatcher** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 5:54 pm

Cygnus wrote: To make my point one more time, for you auction goers with gold burning holes in your pocket, that item you are bidding on wil be auctioned again at the second auction and then again down the road. Maybe a month, maybe 6 months, maybe be every month but it WILL be sold again. And if it is something that everybody would like to have, look for it to be sold in thh deco room or a stone sooner or later.

Maybe i should sell my fire pit and tiki statue now then?

I think a lot of the comments are being voiced because people think i want something back. I don't. I was under the impression i was buying a unique item, I was mistaken, I take it on the chin. No big deal. My issue is with people saying, Well it will be a deco item in a few weeks, i wont buy it at auction. I dont want what is essentially a way to keep the economy balanced to be less efective in doing so.

Danilo Thann wrote: Went to the movies the other day. Saw Fast Five for 2 bucks. Yup value cinema for the win. Who ever went and saw Fast Five on opening day, hasn't sent me hate mail yet, though I am waiting and will post accordingly.

First off your analogy with the movies is again flawed. A better example would be to pay thousands for a firstclass plane ticket to find the seating is the same as in coach. (economy for us aussies). It is a status symbol and a system of how hard you have worked to get there. Like buying a one off tuned Lamborghini only to find it for the same price as a kia rio and being mass produced. Its a supply and demand issue. Some companies reduce the quantity of an item to ensure it remains a high end product. Anyhoo, i feel ive milked this cow enough......

Danilo Thann wrote: Why are we complaining about others having the item... stop whining and just get +Chaos or +Colibri to stop by your house and sign you silly well...
So and So Fancy-Well... Signed by "+Chaos" Issue # 1...
There now you can be recognized for being the first to have something.
In closing... any one can complain about everything... and no one will care... when you start complaining or speaking, rather, about something that can be changed or recognized... that's when people start listening.

This i find laughable..... YOU of all people have the never to say something to me about complaining? I have posted one thing in maybe 6 months.....
Yet going through your posts almost every one is a whine about something coli should be doing, or a problem with a shard, or how everyone uses pets, how this needs to be changed or that needs to be changed. whine whine whine. I think you even wrote a post saying if i dont ask coli ill never know.... I dont care if i get into trouble for this, I am writing a post about something i feel will effect the shard negatively in a polite adult way and you the biggest whinner or the shard (in my opinion) make personal and derogatory remarks towards me.... Maybe if you used pets to hunt you would be able to collect the gold needed to buy decent stuff.

My4c
TheWatcher

Omnipotent · Post by **Omnipotent** » Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:29 pm

TheWatcher wrote: I am writing a post about something i feel will effect the shard negatively in a polite adult way

TheWatcher wrote: ...going through your posts almost every one is a whine about something... ....whine whine whine. I think you even wrote a post saying if i dont ask coli ill never know....

TheWatcher wrote: ...you the biggest whinner or the shard...

Thank you for handling this in a polite adult way!! Take a spanking out of petty cash, you earned it!

Excelsior

Excelsior

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