apologies

[Undertaker]

i am here to make an apology to 2 people... first is neonightmare, for hes bag of holding ... it didnt vanish, i simply stealthed up a took it, it was wrong to do so, and i apologize. he now has it back with all hes contents

2nd person, is Highroller... i am deeply sorry for dragging you into this drama, i shouldnt have done that to you, youve done nothing to me to deserve how i treated you, and for that, my ultimate apology is given, an hope i receive a forgiveness...


on a side note, for those of you who have a bag of holding, colibri had made it where you can pick up anything heavy an place it in there, without getting that message "that is too heavy to place ..." something something something... however that goes, example: pick up 60k and carry it over to the BOH an drop it inside... much more better then dropping it on the ground an hoping you wont crash, etc... haha... always feared that... anywho, my deed is done, enjoy your gameplay, an thank you for stopping by... =]

[+Osiris]

That is very big off you to come out in public and say what you did wrong Undertaker, Hats off for that. But it was wrong what you did.

[+Rayne]

I am glad to see that 1 of your stipulations have been met, Undertaker.

One thing I wish to see upheld here at Excelsior is honesty. Honesty will get you quite far, when coupled with kindness and selflessness. We can all learn from these circumstances that it is better to treat others as we would like to be treated.

I find it always helpful to think before acting. To stop and think that if roles were reversed, and you were to be the victim in the circumstance, how would you feel?

So I look at this situation as a learning experience, not as something that should be solely left to dry up and wither. If remembering this situation causes more individuals to think before they act then this incident is not only an example of justice prevailing but also an example of how we can avoid hurting those around us; strangers or friends.

+Rayne

[Undertaker]

sweet post rayne... but im afraid you only see the frosting of the cake... which btw is chocolate, an sprinkles on top *mmm* ... if you ever want to cut into the cake, please feel free to see if im busy ingame... an ill show you how sweet the cake really is... or you can put the cake in the freezer, but nothing to worry, there will Not be another cake...

(if you understand what i just said, awesome, cuz i just confused myself, an almost have no idea what i said... but ment it in a completely diff way lol)

[OldManAlewar]

[LordGaav]

sweet post rayne... but im afraid you only see the frosting of the cake... which btw is chocolate, an sprinkles on top *mmm* ... if you ever want to cut into the cake, please feel free to see if im busy ingame... an ill show you how sweet the cake really is... or you can put the cake in the freezer, but nothing to worry, there will Not be another cake...

(if you understand what i just said, awesome, cuz i just confused myself, an almost have no idea what i said... but ment it in a completely diff way lol)

I can translate this in a number of ways, most of which are not suited for this forum

[Harabakc]

I don't know if that's a forth coming change, in regards to placing heavy items straight into a bag of holding in your bag but that's not currently how it works.

My own personal opinion on the subject, this shard is no-pk for a reason. No one here wants that kind of crap going on, and if that's what you're looking for out of a shard, go play somewhere else.

[Harabakc]

In fact, now that I go back and look, this is an even bigger deal to me then I had previously remembered.

I quote from the Portal, all of this is publicly viewable, I'm just trimming so it won't be super beyond huge, it'll already be long. This was said on October 2nd from 21.14 and on time wise if any one would like to confirm my quotes.

2.10. 21:14 NeoNightmare: i need a staff member badly
2.10. 21:16 Harabakc: No one seems to be here, what's up?
2.10. 21:17 Undertaker: doin my bees
2.10. 21:17 Harabakc: Nah I meant Neo.
2.10. 21:17 Undertaker: oh
2.10. 21:17 NeoNightmare: my large bag of keeping just dissapeard like a fart in the wind

At this point there was a discussion as to what might have happened.

2.10. 21:22 Harabakc: If someone stealthed and took it that should be against shard rules if I'm not mistaken.
2.10. 21:22 NeoNightmare: yup.. if a bannable offence
2.10. 21:22 Grace: should be..but im not sure it is against the rules
2.10. 21:22 Gavina: it isnt
2.10. 21:23 Harabakc: As a non-pvp shard, I'm pretty sure it is.
2.10. 21:23 Grace: staff should beable to see who has one
2.10. 21:23 Undertaker: half the ppl have one by now

Apparently you thought most people have one, so who cares!

2.10. 21:28 Harabakc: I'd say the non-agreed player harmful actions rule would cover that.
2.10. 21:29 Undertaker: where does it say that?
2.10. 21:29 Undertaker: i read the rules on the website
2.10. 21:29 Harabakc: On the rules page. It doesn't specificaly list that, but I'd interpret that as a harmful action.
2.10. 21:29 Undertaker: says nothing about neos case
2.10. 21:29 Grace: according to Coli..if you can steal it..its yours
2.10. 21:29 Alek Drake: man all of you guys have it good on this shard. alot of the stuff you guys get away with i
2.10. 21:29 Undertaker: ya ive seen him announce it befor

2.10. 21:30 NeoNightmare: if soemoen has it i would like it back please
2.10. 21:30 Alek Drake: on the shard i was on it was hell
2.10. 21:30 Harabakc: Well it's specifically setup to not be a pvp shard.
2.10. 21:30 Harabakc: That's a large reason most of us play here.
2.10. 21:31 Gavina: i prefer pvp actually
2.10. 21:31 Undertaker: right hara, but if something isnt locked down in any form of way, its availble to the public
2.10. 21:31 Undertaker: regardless of where it is, or what is it
2.10. 21:31 Harabakc: Having a blessed item hit the ground for a second is a little different.
2.10. 21:31 Harabakc: Item sniping is seriously questionable.
2.10. 21:32 Undertaker: staff wont look at it like that, its wrong.. yes... its the facts
2.10. 21:32 Undertaker: it was on the ground... someone was there waiting for it...
2.10. 21:32 Undertaker: if thats even the case
2.10. 21:32 Harabakc: The staff here, minus Coli are players, I beg to differ.
2.10. 21:33 Harabakc: That kind of garbage is good for NO ONE, and goes against everything this shard has always
2.10. 21:33 Harabakc: been.
2.10. 21:34 Undertaker: i dunno man...
2.10. 21:34 Grace: i'd say most of us agree with you
2.10. 21:34 Grace: i was just stating what Coli said
2.10. 21:34 Harabakc: I understand.
2.10. 21:34 Harabakc: It just doesn't change anything.

The guy was asking for it back, and you sat there and argued with me about whether it was against the rules or not.

2.10. 21:39 Undertaker: who else has a bag of holding?
2.10. 21:39 Grace: not i
2.10. 21:39 Alek Drake: can someone make me one please
2.10. 21:39 Harabakc: I've got a huge.
2.10. 21:39 Harabakc: I'll actually give you the sextant I have Alek, I never use it.
2.10. 21:39 Undertaker: an for those that do have a BOH, you guys have specific color to it?
2.10. 21:40 Harabakc: White.
2.10. 21:40 Alek Drake: im at tc
2.10. 21:40 Undertaker: ok, i have the color of grass
2.10. 21:40 Undertaker: so i guess most ppl do have diff colors...
2.10. 21:40 Harabakc: I never asked, that's just what I got.
2.10. 21:40 Undertaker: oh u never dyed it?
2.10. 21:40 Harabakc: I figured they all were.
2.10. 21:40 Harabakc: Nope.
2.10. 21:41 Undertaker: ah

Then you acted like it belonged to you, and said yours was green to try and deflect attention away from you.

2.10. 21:59 NeoNightmare: man a large bag of hollding is expensive 400 ed or 45 canadian dollars
2.10. 21:59 Dark Tyranny: person didnt realize either
2.10. 21:59 Harabakc: I've got a gold and arrow auto scav, I have to watch out for that sometimes.
2.10. 21:59 Harabakc: But it won't grab bags.
2.10. 21:59 NeoNightmare: everyone check you packs for a blue backpack
2.10. 21:59 Xiao Bai: blue backpack ?
2.10. 22:00 Gavina: everyone has a blue backpack
2.10. 22:00 Liam: aye, me too but you would have to have a bag to target to set it (for scav agent)
2.10. 22:00 NeoNightmare: ya i used a uni to die it a certian blue

Then the poor guy went so far as to say how much he had donated for it, and said that his was blue because you brought up the color issue. And you just sat there silent.

2.10. 21:56 +Rayne: Dont worry, this will be handled. But I will give the person a chance to come forward before hand.

Rayne even gave you a chance to come forward without getting in trouble and you just sat there. Man... class act, real class act.

[OldManAlewar]

Dude, the man came out and named&shamed himself as an apology.
The last thing he, or this situation need is some added kicking by someone else.

What he did may not have been what you call a "class act" but kicking a man who is already down is at aqual or lever level, dude.
Nobody needs extra drama out of this, why pour oil on the fire.
Be sure that staff gave him all the mental abuse that needed giving, and if you do feel the need to pick a bone with him, do it like a (gentle)man, and do it in private, not wreak additional public drama.

that said (playing devils advocate here), there is *NOTHING* in the rules about picking stuff off the ground, not even now.
AT BEST the most half-assed interpretation is under Header 6 - legal, and 5 -PVP (which this was *NOT*)

5d. We take all non-agreed player-harmful actions very seriously, the penalties for which can be jail or ban.

6a. The rules can change without prior notice. It is the player's duty to stay updated, however we will do our best to let the public know of any major changes made to the rules.

6d. We do not replace lost objects in game, unless maybe if it's due to a crash or server disconnect. We recommend you to insure your valuable items and bond your pets.

So everyone, (myself included) : the issue has been dealt with, no need for furrther drama, the people involved dont need it, and the shard doesnt need this on the frontpage.

[Harabakc]

I am glad to see that 1 of your stipulations have been met, Undertaker.

He had to post, that was a stipulation.

If you care to look back at the log of the day

2.10. 21:51 +Rayne: I will say: Stealing from players, Taking things that you did not earn, Taking what belongs to others, is inappropriate and distasteful.
...
2.10. 21:52 Grace: is there a way to find out if it was actually stolen?
2.10. 21:52 Harabakc: There are few enough of them it should be easy to track down, we'll see.
2.10. 21:53 Harabakc: Especially being a donation item.
2.10. 21:53 +Rayne: Aye, everything is serialized.
2.10. 21:53 Grace: good
2.10. 21:53 NeoNightmare: who ever did it made me cry
2.10. 21:53 Harabakc: Normally I wouldn't be as vocal about stuff like that... but those aren't exactly common, or even
2.10. 21:53 Harabakc: uncommon.
2.10. 21:54 +Rayne: Aye, unacceptable.
...
2.10. 21:56 +Rayne: It is put on the ground to fill it.
2.10. 21:56 Xiao Bai: o.o
2.10. 21:56 NeoNightmare: rayne anychance the bee keeper took it?
2.10. 21:56 +Rayne: No.
2.10. 21:56 NeoNightmare: *crys*
2.10. 21:56 NeoNightmare: man i lost alot of money of stuff on it
2.10. 21:56 +Rayne: Dont worry, this will be handled. But I will give the person a chance to come forward before hand.

He sat there online during all of this, while a staff member flat out said it was unacceptable and said he had a chance to return it with no penalty.

And then when he did post the "apology" he spent half the post trying to change the subject to a game mechanic which no one should have to worry about. So no, you won't see me cheering on his apology. I had no intention of saying anything else about it till I remembered the discussion that went on at the time it was happening and I went back and checked exactly what was said.

I expect to see the rules amended very soon, and I for one would hope that people that play here and are considering playing here would be happy to see the players take a staunch stance against this behavior.

Edit: And as you say, I don't particularly want this on the front page, I'd much rather it would have never happened in the first place.

[OldManAlewar]

I am glad to see that 1 of your stipulations have been met, Undertaker.

He had to post, that was a stipulation.

His other option was to simply bail from the shard like a thief in the night, he chose to stay and put himself on the virtual scaffold.
Additional lynching by people who have absolutely nothing to do with the matter is not needed or helpfull.

If you care to look back at the log of the day

I dont, he has his punishment as it stands (i assume jailtime)

And as you say, I don't particularly want this on the front page, I'd much rather it would have never happened in the first place.

yet you persist on hammering the issue publicly. (and i am silly enough to take this trollbait)

( p.s. nothing personal, but i really dont think any of us, or the shard, needs this smeared out like the butterknife from hell.)

[Lyandrin]

Why hasnt this thread been locked already?

Any more discussion wont help anyone nor the general feeling of this shard.

[+Colibri]

Well, i'd say, let's all accept his apology, forgive him, and get on with our lives.

He had a different idea about what can be taken or not, I know it's not a nice thing to not come forth when +Rayne was asking of it in public chat. And well, even tho he broke out of the 24 hours symbolic jailtime he had...

He apologized, from what I take he will be more thoughtful next time he sees something laying there that can be taken.

All was resolved and ended well. Let's live happily ever after

[leehovan]

All is well. Glad everything is okay =)

Let's shake hands and be friends again ^^

[Llexa]

Well, personally, I think if one is sorry, they do their time, not break out of jail. *just a thought*

Also, it's like public record. If someone commits a crime, everyone is entitled to know. Like a convicted felon. He moves into your neighborhood, and you have a right to know. The more people in the neighborhood who know, the more unlikely it is the felon will do something to them, b/c he is now held accountable by others knowledge of his crimes.

If he has a clean record from now on, great. I hope he does. I don't think people are immune to change. I will give anyone the benefit of the doubt, and ability to earn trust.