Changes to Mining/Lumberjacking veins

[amadman]

I felt about the same way at first to Tael. But as Colibri pointed out this would not make it were you got random ore from a spot.

It would be like it is now except the veins would have a limited supply of ore and would change to another ore type when it ran out.

So a person would still need to hunt and plot their mining spots. And once a person did find spots they would still be able to spot mine them. However they would no longer be 'set' with mining locations once they found a bunch. Instead they would need to balance between finding new spots and working the ones they have found that are not mined out yet.

To me this sounds more interesting and more of a challenge than just mining the same spots I found months (maybe years to some) ago.

[Penny]

Yup, mining was fun until there was no spots find.

[Tael]

I still see no problem worth fixing. If you're bored with mining, I can understand that. I usually mine several hours a day. Yeah, it's boring, but I don't see how suddenly not knowing what I'm going to dig up will make it any more interesting in a lasting, meaningful way. I still need to feed the bulldog, which means I need certain colors when I need them. I also need to know where I can get the ore ele that I want. That's why I spent a lot of effort mapping and marking and railing my spots.

Mining is boring because it's predictable, but it's reliable for the same reason.

[+Colibri]

Yeah I have noticed that many people understand that this would be a change to the random vein mining, where if you dig 30 times at one spot, it would be just giving out misc ores. This is not how it would be. What could be, is a system never seen on any other shard.

Another couple of ideas I would implement:

- Platinum would have more than 1% chance of "spawning" in a certain vein (it's 1% now).
- Increased drop rate of prospector's tools (erm, i think they drop from something, they aren't craftable from what i know right now)
- The use of forensics skill would make you able to get more info about a certain vein.
- - How much ore is still remaining there (it would tell you for example, "there is abundance of ore in this vein" or "it seems that some of it has been mined out", etc, ... "it seems that this vein will soon be mined out")
- - Approx time when someone mined it last. At certain skill of forensics this would only be "this vein hasn't been mined for a long time", etc... "someone just mined here". And at higher skills you would even get the amount of hours when someone mined here.
- Custom craftables would not all just require 100 platinum ingots to craft. A woodworker's key would require 100 toxic, metal workers would require 100 electrum... well, the mobile forge would probably still require platinum.
- And yes, spots would at first be as they are now... and as they are mined out, they would be replaced by others. This would make the popular spots dry out in probably a day or two, while those far away spots that only one person knows about, would probably last for a long time.


In about a month or two i'll run the poll again, with the ideas being finalized (i.e. a complete and final proposal of what exactly would change) and then the voting will be done via PM, both to make sure there's no cheating, and also so that someone doesnt just come here and click No because they were told to. But it will require strong support for this to be changed.

[Kile Morgan]

When I see a basic and simple to fix problem like Darkened Sky finally being a kama perhaps I'd look at this again.

1. I usually can't spend all day on here like some to go out to find a vein of ore that I already went out and found here, just so I can go mine it so later I can try and use it to make something.
2. Is this really a problem? You yourself said you have no way of knowing if anyone really is doing this. So to punish a possible small minority you will again punish everyone by making a worldwide change.
3. From what I understand your change wouldn't affect anyone using that so really all you would be doing is again hurting the average player. We don't have the time to waste looking for a specific ore that we already found. Or worse you force then to use the very thing you claim to want to prevent.
4. I can't recall the last time a poll got shot down and was brought back a fue months later. I'm not much for pvp but that wasn't brought back. It lost, let it die.

Your changes last week have already limited where I can go since you made them worldwide rather then just in fel, I could choose to not go in there. Don't do this too, I can at least still mine if I need to without having to start from scratch.

[amadman]

Colibri - I for one will be voting different next time. The thought of giving a worthless skill some life is the icing on the cake.

Tael - It will not be an issue for people who mine on a regular basis. Those people could know of many nonemptied veins to spot mine from. And if you could tell just how full like Colibri is suggesting then you would know when you needed to start scouting out new ones.

I felt the same way at first. I did not want to lose the spots that I have already found because I can just mine what I need now. But Its all very positive once you get over the idea of losing the spots you know and start embracing the idea of having to hunt new spots to keep your operation running smoothly.

[amadman]

1. I usually can't spend all day on here like some to go out to find a vein of ore that I already went out and found here, just so I can go mine it so later I can try and use it to make something.

Everyone would be having to do the same thing. It would put mining in a different gear so to speak. Imagine finding a platinum vein which forensics says has never been mined. Think about it. You would have just found 500 platinum ore that nobody else knows about yet. If you are in a popular mine then you just might want to start doing some mining. If however you happen to be in an out of the way mine then you will most likely have this all to yourself for some time.

2. Is this really a problem? You yourself said you have no way of knowing if anyone really is doing this. Sop to punish a possible small minority you will again punish everyone by making a worldwide change.

This would be far from a punishment. This would breath new life into the mining skill and the unused skill of forensics.

3. From what I understand your change wouldn't affect anyone using that so really all you would be doing is again hurting the average player. We don't have the time to waste looking for a specific ore that we already found. Or worse you force then to use the very thing you claim to want to prevent.

I think this idea stands on its own without even considering the 'exploit'. However I do believe that this would make people not be able to figure out the 'formula' from the original code because they would no longer be using the original code.

4. I can't recall the last time a poll got shot down and was brought back a fue months later. I'm not much for pvp but that wasn't brought back. It lost, let it die.

Colibri stated that he wants to try this poll again because there was some confusion on what he was meaning to do. He stated that he plans on making things a bit more clear for the next poll. Colibri also hinted that he feels the poll may have been negatively influenced.

[Tael]

Why is BBCode turned off?

Yeah I have noticed that many people understand that this would be a change to the random vein mining, where if you dig 30 times at one spot, it would be just giving out misc ores.

I've mined under a system like that, and it wasn't bad. The higher your skill, the higher your chance of getting the top ores. The point (from my perspective) is that you can script for this, it's less fussy than traditional ore spots, and as it was implemented, there were +10 mining gloves you could get from a quest that made it tolerable.

But I do understand that you're not proposing this. You have something fancier in mind.

This is not how it would be. What could be, is a system never seen on any other shard.

I'm afraid of changes that will make it difficult or impossible to mine effectively with a script. Apart from everything else, mining is dull, repetitive action. Over and over. Hour after hour. Over and over. You get the idea. No matter what you do, it will never be as interesting as hunting.

So except as an arbitrary coding challenge, I don't see the point of changing the mining system. As it is now, mining is boring but dependable. Dressing it up would make it still boring but you'd have to jump through additional, arbitrary hoops. This is not attractive at all for someone who runs ingot vendors.

Spreading the desirability of ores so that people want more than just iron and plat would be good. New crafting stuff would be good. But I'm still against messing with the traditional mining spots.

[ticketguru]

Personally, I am of two minds about this. I understand about all the existing rune libraries and that future rune libraries would be at best time sensitive and at worst, useless. I have done many, many hours of mining and lumbering, both strip mining/lumbering and rune book scripted. I have a large large personal libraries of platinum and petrified sites that I have found myself and losing them would be hard for the high level crafting (particularly plat granite).

However, I still often go out strip mining just to build up a supply of random ores and lumber (and look for new high value sites). So changing to a randomly rotating scheme, would not be horrific. I agree that making the change would make ores and lumber more valuable and I think we would see more people setting up vendors to sell all the colored ores and lumber. In this way, I believe the change is a good one.

Coli, if you were to make a change like this, I would have a check implemented once a day to see if each site would change based on a percentage using the number of days since the last change at that site and the number of the current special ore or lumber already pulled out. So, if a site is currently 15 days old (based on the last time the site changed) and has 200 special mining or lumbered, there would be a x% chance of that site changing today. As the site gets to a certain age or number of specials pulled get closer to number, then the percentage chance of a change to approach (or reach) 100%. That way the maximum age might be 90 days and the maximum specials might be 500. An example could be after 15 days 200 gold ores are pulled from a specific site, then there might be a 15% chance of that site changing to a new random ore the next day and starting the cycle all over again at that spot. But in 75 days, if there has been 200 gold ore pulled, the chance might be 75%; or 400 ores pulled in 10 days could also be 75%.

[Kile Morgan]

Sorry but I'm not going to quite, besides it seems quote isn't working.

There is to me no confusion, example you mine gold out at a place, come back later and instead it could be say copper. It means if you need gold or don't want copper you have to mine somewhere else. It takes even more time from actual play looking for the new site for the same thing. So either players have to spend more time online, pay more for ore and items made by it, or afk mine. All for something that isn't affecting the game. It affects the game as much as using uo auto-map. Oh, and as I understand it the way the game works it wouldn't really affect the person using the resource finder so only the rest of us takes a ding.

It's a non problem with a solution that sounds like it would take a lot of time to code. How long would it take to work out the bugs? I can't get an artifact drop in Tokumo in over twice the time I could with the same stats and less people out there trying lately. The fix for doom have something to do with that? Do we really need to risk more on this? Shouldn't problems that are over a year old and still not fixed come first? Here's an easy example once again: Darkened sky is a No-Dachi instead of a [url]kama:http://uo.stratics.com/database/view.ph ... 66&cat=765[/url]Or would you offer a free weapon type change to those who want the correct weapon? You have the list so it was planned sooner or later I hope.

You mentioned last week. Then, you stated reasons that were specific to fel, yet you implemented something that is worldwide as part of the fix, why? I don't even go to fel because of all the crap I had to put up with in there before, so why should I have to be corrected in Tokumo? Or someone in Umbra? If I put my pet in my pack and stealth around a group to not risk drawing their mob and ticking them off why should I get dinged? Why should I to get dinged again for this when I did nothing wrong. I do not have the time for it usually.

Why not ask the players if they would rather have things like this or being compatible with newer versions of uo. this or more quests, items, skills, and a race or two.

No matter what this was bad timing, I might have been more open myself to a discussion but I tried that last week and went from interested to burned.

[+Colibri]

Your changes last week have already limited where I can go since you made them worldwide rather then just in fel, I could choose to not go in there. Don't do this too, I can at least still mine if I need to without having to start from scratch.

I think the only change that is worldwide is that you cannot unshrink your pets for 30 seconds...

I just really don't like how everyone has been referring to the changes (which have been pretty much reverted) as if "the shard is now un-playable, you can't do anything on this shard anymore"... They have been put back to, well almost as it used to be before. I'm a bit grumpy right now, and I must say i really don't like how if something is made a tad harder, people refer to it as impossible. Well it's offtopic anyway so let's leave that.


----

I'm aware of all the runes marked that would eventually become obsolete...
Anyway, a vote in some time again, and until then maybe there can be a few extra opinions and comments about what could be good and what could be bad.

Keep in mind this is a discussion about something that might never happen.

Stay on topic because I really don't want this thread to become what the PvP thread was.

About BBCode, make sure you don't have the "Disable BBCode" option below checked.

[Kile Morgan]

I will try this a last time then.
I do not want myself or others to be affected or punished for the actions of a person, other group, or area. I do not like having to keep changing what I do, where I go or having to repeat doing the same thing because of the above. If someone mentions something they open the door and I will draw parallels to other recent events to demonstrate why something is good or bad and how it affects others. It was not meant in the way you decided to take it not the second post.

I do not act like I own an area, or try to force people out. I do not act like a resource is mine either. I do not use exploits, bug, etc. I should not pay the price for those who do. It is bad enough that I avoid areas with some spawns or resources and have to find out of the way places because of how SOME have or do behave. This I do so I do not have to put up with it, yet I have to put up with having the fixes affect me also. What I do winds up costing my in not being as far along as i would like even without the things outside this little place. The proposed change would further subtract from that. Is that clearer?

[chizlhead]

I think its a bad idea..How will it affect granites..im lucky to get 1 piece from a spot..And those that sell granites and ingots..sounds like its takin the lil man out of business on hear..and what bout those who are invested here..(been here for awhile) seems like they are leaving cuz of changes..losing customers,players..is bad business. I thought everyone knew that. So what if they know where stuff is..so do i..we know how to mine..i think..lol.plats can be used for portable forges..ok..let who ever is doin it..doit..and sooner or later everyone will have a portable forge..and thats bout as far it will go i tink..and gives u a chance to see whos sellin all the forges..lol

[chizlhead]

I think its a bad idea..How will it affect granites..im lucky to get 1 piece from a spot..And those that sell granites and ingots..sounds like its takin the lil man out of business on hear..and what bout those who are invested here..(been here for awhile) seems like they are leaving cuz of changes..losing customers,players..is bad business. I thought everyone knew that. So what if they know where stuff is..so do i..we know how to mine..i think..lol.plats can be used for portable forges..ok..let who ever is doin it..doit..and sooner or later everyone will have a portable forge..and thats bout as far it will go i tink..and gives u a chance to see whos sellin all the forges..lol

i forgot something..after digging for a lil bit..will it still say no metal to mine here..or can we stay in one spot for hours and mine..also we should be able to mine without getting macro pop ups..to see if were there or not..give a lil too

[chizlhead]

I think its a bad idea..How will it affect granites..im lucky to get 1 piece from a spot..And those that sell granites and ingots..sounds like its takin the lil man out of business on hear..and what bout those who are invested here..(been here for awhile) seems like they are leaving cuz of changes..losing customers,players..is bad business. I thought everyone knew that. So what if they know where stuff is..so do i..we know how to mine..i think..lol.plats can be used for portable forges..ok..let who ever is doin it..doit..and sooner or later everyone will have a portable forge..and thats bout as far it will go i tink..and gives u a chance to see whos sellin all the forges..lol

i forgot something..after digging for a lil bit..will it still say no metal to mine here..or can we stay in one spot for hours and mine..also we should be able to mine without getting macro pop ups..to see if were there or not..give a lil too.its only metal..lol..Also is it on a rotation..did i read it rite? So does that mean the plat spot will move? or what ever the resource is..wood...etc