New type of PvP on the shard

[Llexa]

[quote="Aidan"]it's amazing.. half of the people here ignore newer players.. try to keep "secrets" that are part of the game.. [/quote]

I don't know where you get your numbers for 1, and I don't think that half player "ignore" new players. alot of people stay logged in even when they are afk or not at around at all in case we have a milestone moment. Also, there are things people are meant to find out for themselves. It robs people of the game if you tell them everything they ask you about, or offer up information without being asked. I would have been so p/o'ed if, when I started playing here, everyone just told me every special spawn, every special boss, etc. And I wasn't asking for this stuff, I checked the website, and did things in due time. I would go with a group of people to something maybe, or just go off exploring. The only new players I personally would ignore are those who come in saying "give me this, give me that, where is this, where is that, i want gold, someone give me some" ect.

[quote='"Aidan"]then have the nerve to complain about the "attitude" that pvp brings... YES the poll is closed but why should the debate over it end? obviously it's not going to happen but why NOT talk about? [/quote]

b/c its not constructive. everything has already been said, both sides are argued, and that's that. if anyone wants to keep it going, it's for the wrong reasons and to argue. everything has been said, and in different orders. Only thing left is to see it all written backwards :P

[quote="Aidan"]Is it possible to be THAT afraid of pvp that you can't even TALK about it? just wow....[/quote]

i dont think anyone is afraid of pvp, it's def not the right word. people despise it b/c its a selfish, rude, egotistical concept (due to lack of time/screening for selective pvp-and even decent players can become ruined by it, ie- getting banned or jailed for breaking rules)

[quote="Aidan"]I'm for pvp period whether the shard has been here for 3 years or 3 days without is is irrelevant[/quote]

1. why aren't you on a pvp server then for when you want to pvp? people said they go play one shard for the occasional pvp 'need' (lol) and play here for the rest. 2. i guess you don't care about the shard in this statement, as you dont care how long its been around or it's family oriented reputation, or the fall outs that happen from adding new ideas without thinking them through, or about being a responsible shard owner. Just b/c a kid wants to play in the street doesn't mean he should get to.

[quote="Aidan"]you HAVE to add new things to keep it interesting[/quote]

Seems to me that there are TONS of new stuff out there you won't find anywhere else. And i would almost wager you havent done all of these things yet (nor most people here). but, even if you have, they are repeatable :D And, ever since Colibri's post then Rayne's post, i am really on the staff's banwagon and i seriously doubt it is fair to imply that without even more new things added that it's not interesting. There is something called... contentment.

[quote="Aidan"] is it YOU that's going to be killed? are YOU going to pvp? if not why should it matter to you, the rules wouldn't allow you to be harmed.. [/quote]

*sigh* i wish you would read before posting, seriously. Im not going to repeat myself for the 3rd time so you will have to read my posts, 2x back. It's pretty crystal clear why (i believe) PvP is a problem even for those who arent reds AND between reds themselves.

[quote="Aidan"] sorry but you scream out against the pvp "attitude" yet even without BEING a pvp'r the attitudes WITHOUT pvp aren't much better[/quote]

no one is perfect, and if we go by your logic, that attitude exists without pvp, then by that logic, adding pvp would be an even worse idea then previously argued b/c it was increase the attitude/hostility. thanks for proving my case :D

love,
Llexa

p.s. i will repeat this again, b/c it's true: I dont think that anyone wants pvp here b/c they want to bring the annoyance and headache and loads of work for staff, etc, but it is inevitable. there is lots and lots of rule writing, lots of scripting, lots of PM's and pages about unbelievable allegations/statements/complaints/justifications which leads to jailing/banning and lashing out from player to player....... blah. I've seen it, i've played it, and it's not worth the the rumors, the forum posts, and im sure its not worth all the babysitting staff have to do with the pms and paging. if we were soley a "red" server, with no rules, then sure, easy as pie, but we arent.

[Sorgon]

Just wanted to chime in stating I totally disagree with pvp here. I for one came here due to the fact that this is a pvp shard. I am not against pvp at all When I first started UO there was only Fell. My first character was a nox mage/archer. All i did was pvp. But that was what 10 years ago(prolly more my memory is bad) now and pvp in uo is well lets just say very lame in my opinion. If i wanted to pvp I would play one of the MANY other games that focuses on pvp.
This shard is so inviting due to the fact thay we are a very tight community and we dont have pvp and the grief that goes along with it. lets all get along and kill some Badguys PVM style ;-)

[Kile Morgan]

A discussion is healthy. Discussing different points of view should be encouraged. I did not ask for this thread to end because I wish to see that end but because it has like in the game chat gone from that to flaming. It serves no point. I have not insulted anyone, have not told anyone to drop it or shut up in here or in the game. Now last friday when things were getting out of hand I did state that by behaving exactly the way those who were against this idea said they would they made their point for them. For this I was then told by one of the very people who had begun arguing over chat to drop it. Another basically said to shut up and then continued to bash others who didn't agree with them. How is that a discussion, how is that open minded? Another problem are these blanket statements. Not everyone is doing anything, I started out willing to go with this and because of the actions of some of the people pushing for this had my mind changed. In here I was willing to just come in and read what was said without any more comments until some people's actions changed that. I have also stated that there have been problems from people on both the main side of the argument. It isn't a matter of being afraid of either, it's simply a matter of seeing it slowly go from a discussion to this. A last thought. If this continues to degrade you risk making more people become unwilling to consider this in the future. So look back at what you are typing and see if that is really what you mean because as it looks to me you are insinuating a further argument not promoting a further discussion.

[Tribecca]

Now that I have gone back and actually read every single post, there are two things that are painfully obvious to me.

1) Many of the posters on this thread didn't even read the critieria Colibri put up, or they wouldn't have responded the way they did.

2) Many of us have had bad experiences with PK, because true PVP characters would not have complaints. They would have suggestions.

One suggestion I have is to make the PVP dungeon we have now this way that suggested here by Colibri. This way people can come in and watch how fun it could be without fear of being ganked. Spice up the dungeon more with monsters or rares in chests or something. A special mob that drops a rare item in that dungeon that can only be obtained there. (Don't trash me about "that's not fair to those of us who don't PVP" because these rares will start showing up in auctions and on vendors.)

I say bring it on in the PVP dungeon we already have. If its a big hit, then expand it.

[+Colibri]

Yes i also think that some players didn't actually read my first post with all the info, and voted either by imagination or after reading a few comments. Still the outcome is very strong against it, so it will stay like this. Perhaps we can have a revote in a year

[Sorgon]

I for one did read it and understand how it would work. I just dont like the idea Fully. Lets say if you could flag pvp and have the time frame to change back be 3 days...people would want the option to place houses in Fel for a safe spot. But at that point people would want to mark in fel, then you would need to move the champs (houses next to them) I could go on and on.....
I just really think in the long run this shard would become just like any other and would lose the "family" feeling. This is only my opinion or my 2 cents.

[Kile Morgan]

I also read the description of how it would work and it seemed alright. I at first would have gone for it if things had not started to devolve as they did. It wasn't the pvp or the possibility of seeing people around me involved in it that changed my mind. I had no problem with adding more so others could enjoy themselves and still do not. I have a problem with how some are handling it. Be it to try and force it to happen or try and stop it. I also agree that about bringing it up again. I would hope it would not take a year to do so. I do however wish that it start first with a discussion of how and where to implement it and the rules of conduct involved and then once it is ironed out and if it does not become insinuation and insults then have it progress to a vote. A last suggestion, as it is being discussed having a trade channel perhaps a pvp channel could also b discussed when this comes back around. Then any comments or such could be kept in it and perhaps limit the problems that came in this time.

[Jillmuffit]

I really like the PvP channel idea. Make it so that if you go red.. you can only use PvP channel and guild channel. Still enforcing the rules like no swearing/insulting of course but at least the blues wouldnt have to worry =]

[Llexa]

[quote="Aidan"]llexa this was not a bash directed at you and i'm sorry if it came across that way. [/quote]

oh i know this wasn't directed at any one person, so no worries. that's why i stated some things in parenthesis b/c it was my opinion about it, and im not speaking for every single person. But I also stand by what i said, b/c it's realistic, and i've seen it with my own eyes, not just hyped up hearsay or 2nd hand info.

love,
Llexa

*Edit* and also should mention that i have read every post also, and understand colibri's proposal totally.

[fingers]

I have been very very friendly to Chroma in the pvp dungeon today. I gave him some candy... Twice! That's 10k less on that 40k insurance he was bragging about the other night, i guess?

I still think that pvp on this server is soooooooo wrong in soooo many ways (artifacts 70, druid spells, clerical heals for 100 damage, pets, bio pets, etc). I just went down the dungeon, 10 kills, no deaths, on my own, and I still don't feel like it was fun

Oh, and dont be an insult to the intelligence of so many people who voted against the idea. I have red the proposal, as many others did (they mentionned in their post). If 2/3 of population votes for, lets say Obama, aint it a little strange that the other 1/3 say that its because the majority didn't understand?

[Undertaker]

lmao fingers...

[Shal]

When I started on this server I didn't ask for help nor did I receive any from the players that are here now other than the generous and much appreciated things I found in the donation room. Whenever I asked a question in chat I got the standard "uostratics.com" answer even tho alot of the questions couldn't be answered on stratics!! I got so sick of the "omg noobs!!" attitudes in chat when someone new asked a question I was ready to scream and occasionally did!! I finally got to the point I wouldn't ask anything in chat. After a couple of weeks playing I found one person that was kind enough to show me around and I felt comfortable pming and asking questions to and she's no longer here.

Since then I've been able to help new and vet players alike!! I also try to answer any questions that are asked in chat if I'm able to. I also enjoy PVP!! It doesn't make me a bad person or change my play style nor does it stop me from helping others out when needed!!

Everyone wants to talk about the atmosphere and the type of players pvp brings and I will agree that it does get that way on a server that allows it to. But it also gets that way w/o pvp!! I've seen it here quite a few times already...

All that said, this poll has shown me that any form of actual PVP sadly will not happen here...

[Undertaker]

cuz the main reason a majority of the people here joined this shard is to be pvp-free ... meaning, No PvP ... an that also means Nothing to DO with pvp catagory... the closest we got is the pvp dungeon, an you got all these warnings to run thru befor entering the actual pvp dungeon... and by that, we dont hear Any type of talking from or by the pvp dungeon, is not heard (by we, i mean anyone else who doesnt hear anything that goes on in the pvp dungeon when 2 ppl dish it out).. and that is how it should be... now... putting this system in, would mean you have 20+ players doing all that, err, 16+ players (the few who say they wouldnt have a change in attitude), you cant silence them from the [chat, you cant silence them from pm, you cant even silence them in person, your gonna hear all about the pvp talk, etc... may be good, or may be bad- by that i mean, it could be fun talk, "ya we had alot of fun today", or the bad "that **** **** *** is a worthless ************************************** " you get my point now? ...

its kinda funny for me to say this, but it will be true, you will get a small group of trouble makers, who will join this server, an build their character up, an wait out the Age (whatever it will be set at, 30 days, 60 days, etc to pvp) and they will be the ones that will ruin the shard... it wont be you shal to cause chaos, or tribecca, or anyone else who has been here a few month that enjoy this server... it will be the ppl who want to crash it, even if it takes 6 months to do that...

an btw, my younger bro (true pvper) told me that, theres ppl that actully do that stuff... so i asked Why, whats the point?... he said, because its fun to start a little fire, and watch the fire build... and they just watch and laugh, sad eh?, but true... and dont bother saying "well those are the ones who will be banned, prob solved" ... one last thing to add to this part, is he told me on the server he plays, even the bad pvpers do that to the shard, and the admins dont do anything, and neither the staff, infact they are actully corrupted,,, they will add a little bit more to their characters, to Hook up their friends with a little more uber stuff, And will even Lower some stuff on the ppl they dont like... how sick is that... now i know that prolly wont happen here, but you will get those type of ppl here, and even the ones playing here now, some will turn to be like them, so you wont really know who started the trouble, or the fire i should say

[Dark Tyranny]

I have sat back and read all the posts on this subject and thought about it.
I used to play UO gamers and I played Defiance for a while. Those shards catered heavily to pvpers and had some of the biggest jerks around.
I don't think this shard needs the kind of dirtballs I have seen on other shards that do nothing but pvp and talk smack.
I came to this shard because it was peaceful and didn't have that element here.
I think that if you start now with any type of pvp like that you will start to bring in that bad element and with public chat it would destroy this shard for what many of us came here for.
If you allow the pvp and the bad element show up, I and many other will seek out new shards that don't have this element.
I love this shard and most definately don't wanna leave, but I will if I have to put up with the bad seed that pvp will bring.
I voted no and wish I could vote no 50 more times.

[Undertaker]

the point i guess i was making was, were not Scared of pvp, its were tired of pvp Together... which is Why it was the MAIN reason we joined this shard was to have NO pvp dealings... so really, that is the main point us non pvpers are trying to make in the last 90 posts.... doesnt matter what kind of pvp, you want pvp? theres the dungeon...