Excelsior

To those who like to jump in on someones else's kill...Don\'t...Its just rude to do that to someone, have some respect for the person that is killing whatever it may be from a balron to a earth elemental or whatever...If you wanna kill the same thing the person is killing....Ask if you can join in or share, just don't go killing stuff just because you think you may be cool for doing so...That won't get you anywhere but disrespected in the game by anyone who you may be doing stuff like this to...I won't name name's but you know who you are so please have the decency for others here on the shard like most people do...Thanks and have a nice day!

I have been seeing a lot of people getting an attack or two in on paragons, for the chance at drops. IMHO, if you are both in the area farming I don't see a problem with someone getting a couple hits in on a paragon I am killing

I agree with u mate but...as long as they ask permission first.

The codex is clear on this:

A)

"6. Behavior, attitude towards other players:
a. If there is more than one player at a spawn, the players must take turns. Once a player kills/tames a monster or takes/steals an item, he or she must go in the back of the line and wait for others to get their turn."

B) Minor acts

Taking turns at a spawn

October 1st, 2013:
- If player A is waiting for a creature to spawn, and player B comes to the area, player A goes first, followed by player B, and then player A again. If a third person comes to the spawn, they are added to the end of the line.
- If a player is fighting a monster, and dies, they keep their right to fight it. A player is allowed 2 minutes to resurrect and come back to the fight. They are only allowed one resurrect for this purpose. A second death means that the next person in line can start attacking the monster.
- If a player is hidden, it is considered that they are not in line. If other players know that someone is there, hiding, they may still honor his or her place in line, if they chose to.
- When the monster spawns and the first person in line is away from keyboard (does not engage in combat and/or is not responding), the next player in line can proceed to attack the monster. In this case, the first player loses his or her place and must go to the back of the line.

C) I dont remember where, but one of the staff members wrote something like this (paraphrasing): basically if u see someone killing a monster, its their kill and u cant jump on in it unless u ask permission first. (the logic got stuck in my head, hence why i rememeber it )

hope this helps cheers!

Yes i know the codex and no they didn't ask...that's why i posted in the first place, it seems to be happening at some spots more and more the last few months and then when you go and say something to them they ignore you which i think it just makes it even worse...I got no problem with sharing with someone, but if that's the case...they should ask first before attacking while the creature is being killed and so forth.

One other thing of note...

I have had instances of running through an area when their mob attacked me and my character started shooting 1 or 2 arrows at their mob before I was out of range (i know a couple mobs ended up dying as a result). Happens on occasion with mobs that flee when they are almost dead.

Back when I used to roam around with pets, running past and something would attack 1 of my pets and they would 1 or all go and attack on it. Saw it happen many times in Blood Dungeon. Sometimes by the time you realize it and get your pets off of the mob it is either dead or almost dead...

Just trying to make sure people are aware that sometimes it is an accident due to the way the game mechanics works when people/pets attack their mobs. It is usually easy to weed out the accidental ones vs the intentional ones. Intentional ones repeat it a lot, accidental ones don't happen as often.

Sir Blood wrote:One other thing of note...

I have had instances of running through an area when their mob attacked me and my character started shooting 1 or 2 arrows at their mob before I was out of range (i know a couple mobs ended up dying as a result). Happens on occasion with mobs that flee when they are almost dead.

Back when I used to roam around with pets, running past and something would attack 1 of my pets and they would 1 or all go and attack on it. Saw it happen many times in Blood Dungeon. Sometimes by the time you realize it and get your pets off of the mob it is either dead or almost dead...

Just trying to make sure people are aware that sometimes it is an accident due to the way the game mechanics works when people/pets attack their mobs. It is usually easy to weed out the accidental ones vs the intentional ones. Intentional ones repeat it a lot, accidental ones don't happen as often.

Intentional or not, it is your responsibility to control your pets. Often, players lack the foresight to think, I am entering a spawned area that other players frequent. In this scenario, perhaps wait to unleash/unshrink your pets until the spawn is yours. Some common sense goes a long way here. I recently had a scenario where I was waiting for a mob to spawn. Another player came in with their 5 imps. We were sharing the screen and I was clearly waiting, but as the mob spawned, it went toward the other player. Did they back away? No. Instead with all 5 imps set to "guard," they attacked and obtained looting rights to the spawn where I was waiting in line. Did that player apologize or back away? No, they of course had their autolooter running as well pulling the gold and items from the corpse. When I pointed out this rule violation, the player stated that it was "a free dungeon." While it's commonly understandable that this player was in the wrong, another player could "unintentionally" make the same mistake.

TL;DR, Everyone should take personal responsibility over themselves and their pets. Most "accidents" can be avoided. When traveling in highly trafficked areas, shrink the pets, turn off the autolooter/auto attack, etc.

ive had 2 instances in last few weeks where player just jumped in on spawn with out asking or without waiting for me to finish current spawn. was like they owned the place and were entitled to do what they want, when and where they want no matter what. the first time the person used the phrase "sorry me no speaky English" and low and behold that's what they said the 2nd time also. the 2nd time they were sayin it to a +gm. There was no hollerin and cussin or such, it just seemed coincindental (sp?) that within a week or so 2 people used the same excuse to explain away their bad behavior. so in the future ill just leave and not let them spoil my play time

That is my general thought. I just leave and let them have at it. But i dont feel like that is the way it should be.

dreamstalker wrote:ive had 2 instances in last few weeks where player just jumped in on spawn with out asking or without waiting for me to finish current spawn. was like they owned the place and were entitled to do what they want, when and where they want no matter what. the first time the person used the phrase "sorry me no speaky English" and low and behold that's what they said the 2nd time also. the 2nd time they were sayin it to a +gm. but nuttin really happened either time. so in the future ill just leave and let them have it and find someplace else to be.

Just to clarify, what do you mean by "nuttin really happened"?

We have been getting many pages regarding this type of behavior, and we document each encounter. If a staff member comes in after the behavior, it is hard to conduct an investigation and make a judgment on players who are involved. If we see it happen, it is a different story.

If it was their first offense, then we can only warn. If it is a matter of us listening to people tell a story with accusations and us not directly observing the offense or a recording of the offense, then the transition from warning to punishment is less...clean? Then we have to weigh in other factors like player's demeanor with staff and other players, the frequency of being paged on, consistency of stories on a case by case basis...

This is not aimed at any particular person, but this is a case that this following statement needs to be tied to:

Just because you do not see a punishment or a recording of a player's offense or report, does not mean that the player got off or didn't receive a punishment. You can call it another nail in their coffin for a future offense.

It is very important to page when these things happen. Page with player names, the person doing the behavior and the people who observed it. If you have recording software (I believe Razor has a feature) and can utilize it, then do so. I will make efforts to get that from you and will use it for making decisions.

+V

I meant to say that nothing really happened between the person that jumped in and myself. first time I didn't say nothing cept that's not cool and they replied no speaky English. 2nd time the person doing the jumping in said one for u one for me after the choice of jumpin in without so much as a how do u do. nothing really happened as far as us hollering and yelling at one another. not my place or my desire to say what happened after a +gm intervenes. you couldn't pay me enough to get me to even attempt to do yalls job. nope never wont even try

Just wanted to throw in a couple remarks here:

If you guys don't report it to us, that player stays at a first warning for a long time. If you report it, you may feel petty/silly, but if that's the case, why does it bother you at all? Basically, report it so we can do something about it on repeat offenders; or let it go and stop letting it bother you. It's either worth stopping the behavior - in which case you need to be doing your part to help stop it - or it's not - in which case you should move on. I would prefer it stop, personally, but it's up to y'all to page.

Also, dreamstalker - If a player claims that they don't speak english as part of a rule violation issue, I check their logs to see if they are lying to try and get out of it. In the incident which I assisted with the other day - that player has almost never spoken any english on this shard, and when they have it's been barely understandable. It is clear they genuinely do not speak much english at all. While this does not absolve anyone from a rule violation, it does explain their abrupt statements to you. You being angry and unpleasant toward me and the other player and abruptly leaving before I could finish was not helpful to the situation. Just because you don't want to believe that they are telling the truth about their lack of english, does not mean you should become part of the problem. If you'd have stayed to let me finish I would have explained to you that I'd checked their logs and they *were* telling the truth, but that it wouldn't prevent them being written up for this incident. In the future - and this goes for everyone - if you're reporting a rule violation, show the staffer assisting you some respect and stick around until they're finished. There's probably some important info you will miss out on if you bail, and it's not helpful for you or for us if you're not there to hear it.

Anyway, as +V said earlier, it's best to make a hotkey to record a razor video, or a video with any program you may wish to use. When someone comes in, start recording so you can catch it if they're kill stealing. Sadly, unless we see it or we can see in the logs that the person essentially admitted to doing it, there's not a lot we can do. Video evidence can count as us 'seeing' it, and thus lead to jail time. You can send such video to +C (ca@uoex.net), or to me (nyx@uoex.net). Please also submit a page in-game, and escalate that page if you must log off before it's caught. Mention that you've sent a video and to whom for easier sorting on our end.

As for the trav key room - where a lot of the issues seem to be stemming from lately - I'm considering adding a share/wait keyword door before the NPC. I'm still mulling over how best to do it, but it's become quite an issue in the last month or two and I'm frankly tired of dealing with it >.<

I apologize for leaving like i did, i was not trying to disrespect u or any staffer. While i will admit
i was a bit miffed at the other guy, i only left because once you arrived i figured you had the log
and didnt think that.i would be of any help and may have become part of the problem if i had stayed
I mean it gets confusing sometimes when two or more people are talking. Anyways specifically to you
+Nyx i read you comments a few times and agree whole heartedly with your views of how and what should
be done in these situations. Previously i was doing/handling this stuff the way i thought was somewhat
appropriate but now that you have clarified it and i see it from your point of view i think your way will
Probably work so much better. I have been here over 5 years havent been perfect the whole time. I will
however try to look at it from your point of view and act accordingly. Again i apologize for leaving like
i did. Look forward to playing in the best freeshard for another 5 years or more

No problem at all, I wasn't upset by it. It's just unfortunate when folks don't stick around long enough to get all of the information. I mean, you might've kept thinking that guy was jerking you around about not understanding english very well, and that would've affected your view of him (and other players with the same language barrier) in the future. But, when you know they really don't understand it very well it's a bit easier to take these situations in stride

The issue gets complicated by places like the Gnaw cave, where someone might leave it to kill a changeling. ie: having just ducked out of a spawn area, or chased something out.

I think I've even poached and not realized it in places like that.

I suppose I'm just saying awareness of the problem is needed, hence the good thing about this thread

I suppose it's also up to us to keep a better eye on our youngsters who might not get this concept so well, like my 11 yr old who plays here.

Oh, and how does this apply to recall levelers? Do they count as being in the queue in anyway if they just recall in and out?

Recall levelers don't count as 'in line'. If someone wants to stop and wait for the spawn, then they will be considered in line. But if someone leaves that 'line' - by hiding, logging out, leaving the area, etc - they are no longer considered in line and don't get to claim rights to the spawns.

Hope that makes sense!