One down, how many to go?

[fingers]

Amongst the several nerfs that we got, the bio pets need to be fed, otherwise they can go wild. Last week I lost one of my bios. I have two and I always get them out toghetter, and feed them toghetter, so losing one makes no sens. Even if it was fully suited and wearing the spirit of totem, I elected not to pay 100 Eds and to just add it in the list of the lost items that I had to support, either by the fact that a player could reveal me in tram (long time ago) or the fact that some other player lured the dark father in the secret mage room, but was deemed inocent as "it was not clear that this was done on purpose".

Tonight i saw this in chat:

9.11. 09:11 Schogall: have anyone see my bio with name Angelika ?
9.11. 09:11 cabeludoCDC: haha, no
9.11. 09:11 cabeludoCDC: you dont use pet sumoning ball?
9.11. 09:12 Schogall: yes i have a sumon ball on the bio, he say is not my pet
9.11. 09:12 Crystle Wolf: same here
9.11. 09:13 Cyrano De Bergerac: lost my pet like that last week (bio) tuyrned wild supposedly
9.11. 09:13 DarkClod: Then Schgall it probbley want wild so you probbley have to page Calibri about it like
9.11. 09:14 DarkClod: what day and date it was when you last saw it.
9.11. 09:14 Cyrano De Bergerac: colibri will charge 100 eds
9.11. 09:14 Schogall: yesterday morning
9.11. 09:14 DarkClod: yeah but that is the only way to get it back
9.11. 09:15 DarkClod: Schgall you have to page Calibri only way to get it back so you have to have sum Ed
9.11. 09:17 Schogall: Well then I say goodbye again, so does the game no fun anymore, so bb

*Shagall logs off*

So, I wonder if the loyalty system is broken for the human bios, as they seem to turn wild pretty fast. And I hope that people in charge of the decisions are able to realize the effect that certain nerfs have on the less fortunate players, thoses who are not stacking millions by reselling the fruit of their "donations".

[+Veritas]

First things first...

It is unfortunate that you lost your bio pet, and I personally apologize for the hassle and headache this has caused/is causing. With that said, it has been a reoccurring trend in the past that if a single player comes forwards and says "My bio pet is gone, where did he go?", and the bio pet is found in the designated wild bio pet area of the shard, then there is a 99.9% chance that the player did indeed forget to feed it or logged without putting it in the stables (Supported by Colibri's loading previous saves and checking the loyalty of the pet). So, when I hear this issue when it comes up every once in a while, I take reference to history and make the assumption that this is the case...considering all the pieces fit the scenario.

NOW...having multiple players come forward and say this is happening to them, is indeed different. This was something not apparent to myself when I came to you about your missing bio pet...hence why I treated the situation as if it was a matter of accidental negligence. Now that I have more information, I will let Colibri know about the situation if he doesn't already know.

Also, don't accuse us of just randomly nerfing things for the sake of nerfing. I can tell from your tone in our PMs and on your recent forum posts that there is a lot of resentment and assuming. What can I do to help?

+V

[fingers]

Hello +V and thanks for your answer.

First, I hope you don't think that my rant has anything to do with MY bio. I am not 100% sure i didn't misclic it while putting in stables or just forgot it. I am 90% sure I didn't forget it, but I figure that making you guys look into it is not worth your time nor to mine.

The problem I have goes much deeper and has to do with losing members of the community, often my best friends in game (Calan, Karma...).

I am sure all of the players gone would have agreed that when an activity gives alot more advantage than other activities, it needs to be nerfed.

They went, not because of the "nerfs", but because they felt they had no say in the direction the shard is taking. I don't care either about the nerfs, because my experience and the gear I managed to put toghetter will always give me an edge when it comes to farming gold and items.

Now if we compare bios to imp pets, we find that to use a bio in fel requires 10 powder of translocation vs 0 for imps (they can be shrunk). We also can notice that, if none will lose stats upon death, both lose skills, but the bio loses some (poisoning) that will never come back. My imps, I got them as loot on peerless bosses and added 200 oinments (worth about 1 mil) as opposed to paying 8 mil for one bio and equipping it with SoT (2 mils) and alot of reflect armor/good sc weapon... Finally it is common knowledge that 5 imps deal several times more damage than a bio pet.

I beleive that you guys are not " just randomly nerfing things for the sake of nerfing". That being said, making the cost of summoning them in fel pass from 1 to 10 and giving them the ability to go wild could certainly have, at the very least, been debated. From my point of view, it is unfair and very costly for the little citizen who doesn't have millions upon millions to absorb the loss.

I have talked to several vets who feel the same way but wont speak up because they FEAR the consequence of doing so. I prefer being naive and keep thinking that you guys are motivated to do the right thing. Proof being the marvelous things that you, +V take the time to put toghetter and offer us all the time (Sgail, weekly quests, Umbris camp, Wrong, Halloween area, events, etc.)

So by all means, give the community a voice! Please!!!!

[Dramoor]

Personally, I gather you just wish u could be unresponsible, and keep bios all over the place not feed them and they dont go wild, were even though we can shrink a pet, we can still lose it if we dont feed it. As you can still stable a bio. I mean i understand u pay a lot for the thigns and stuff. But come on, We need to haev some responsiblities in the game. Take your part in it Feed your pet, its not hard. Trans powder is not very expensive, and can be farmed very easily in a very short period of time. If you want to be lazy and leave your bio out wherever u last sumoned them and it goes wild cuz u werent feeding it. Not to mention if i am not mistake, On OSI, ur pet looses loyalty faster if u are not near them. I dont know if that is the same on this shard. But Was like that on OSi servers. So It should be common knowledge to feed a pet/Stable them. I Do not write this to be rude. But to prove points that, Come on people, have some responsiblities and feed/stable those pets and come on, do u leave your bio out for more then 12 hrs without feeding it? I think that is roughly the timer for it to go wild wihtout being fed?

This game is based off sorts of reality, responsiblities, and consequences.
If you take that fun out of the game. We are left with a game That is Basically nothing but a game enhanced by cheat codes.

And you say give the community a voice, It has a voice, If we had no voice, there would be no forums.

[fingers]

Dramoor, I will make it short:

I have had 6 imp dogs since 3 years and 2 bios since about the same time. I have never lost one, cept for this one last week. Mentionning that "you just wish u could be unresponsible" is in fact rude and ignorant.

I couldn't care less for my lost bio because to my point of view the different nerfs they suffered makes them trash for me now. Granted I can easily take the 10 mil+ loss and move on, I can perfectly see why other players would lose all motivation over such a loss.

The point is not to know if 10 powder of translocation is expensive or not, but to understand how the modifications brought to the bios were necessary in a shard balance point of view. That guy that I quoted got disgussed and logged out, most likely for ever. I say it's worth questionning ourselfs about that matter.

Being able to write on this forum and getting our voice heard are two things.

[+Veritas]

I prefer being naive and keep thinking that you guys are motivated to do the right thing.

Thank you for your naivete, and the slap in the face that is implied in the statement. But, I will ignore that for now...

If you genuinely think that it was a server hiccup, then I have no problem referring the situation. In addition to putting my time into this shard's content and quests after I come home from work, I like to trouble shoot issues. So, by all means, page and I (anyone) will put that request in...if you genuinely believe it was a server error.

Also, one of the friends you listed had a say, however he ruined his opportunity. He was a consistently rude player to staff and had no respect for authority. Sure, that probably made him look debonaire, had a cool rebel without a cause way about him, whatever. I listen and consider the opinions of only those who are capable of showing me the same respect they insist they receive.

Now about the bio and imp comparison. Would it surprise you if I said I hold the same opinion you do...and have had it for quite some time? Perhaps have the imps lose somewhere in the arena of 5.0 skill and have a recharge time for their being pulled out from the last time they were leashed? Maybe have it so the only way they can be healed is through veterinary? Maybe make the summoning cost 5 powder and have an expensive (but existing) leash that can shrink biopets that only the younger players can get...so there is another way to inject the youth into the mainstream trading market of the shard. There are any number of things to do. I don't think that creating a thread to share your opinions is something that will get you jailed, unless you create it to say something like this:

"Look you morons, we need bio leashes, <Insert vulgar statement here>. Hugs n Kisses...whomever"

I will say that many threads with statements like this, will more than likely get you dismissed regardless of a valid point:

I prefer being naive and keep thinking that you guys are motivated to do the right thing.

You tell me...if someone comes to you and makes a statement like that to your face, how motivated are you going to be to help that person out?

I will put in the page myself and escalate it myself regarding your lost biopet that you believe was unjustly missing. And...pretty please...before you continue downing the collective staff judgement and shard mechanics in the form of global chat messages and occasional responses to threads, please consider the possibility that we might actually be motivated to do the right thing when it comes to maintaining a fun gaming community for this shard's player base. Thanks.

+V

[fingers]

Thanks for your answer +V

Please remember that english is my second language and I am sorry if I have sadden you with my "naive" comment.

I have exchanged my point of view with veteran players concerning certain nerfs we had and they informed me that going public about it could have some consequences; that they would certainly not do so. I beleive you are good guys and therefore I might be naive, but I go ahead and share my concerns.

I hope this clarifies my position.

Thanks!

[anarchy]

sorry fingers your a cool dude, and i respect you for what you've gained, achieved, and accomplished, but blaming a possible player side mistake and the loss of said player; shouldn't reflect the staff. i remember my first bio (300 eds) and i paged a gm. i believe there was a 1st time losing replacement of said bio was still in affect. now if schollgal would have relaxed instead of violating rule 5 c. No drama. Accept the things you cannot change. If you are in an unresolvable conflict, be the smart one and walk away. Keep the private problems out of public chats, send a private message instead. *yes i know i sometimes violate this rule too, and i know it's not easy one to follow*. he might of been able to get his bio back at no cost, or maybe he might have been able to contact me; as i would have just made him a new bio and we'd have fun gathering gear for it* rather than see a player leave *this is case to case and i don't always replace things for people*, but i have been known in the past to help players retrieve their items.

now cost.

Maybe make the summoning cost 5 powder and have an expensive (but existing) leash that can shrink biopets that only the younger players can get.

that's brilliant!
i would love to see bio's be able to shrink but never thought to make it so young can only make them. let's say 3 months because then it also helps the middle players not just the young. also, +Veritas has said in the past that he agrees that imps/bio's are way unbalanced but with a full time job, driving in a busy area, housekeeping, personal real world things, doctor appointments, dentistry, cooking, time with g/f, and creating weekly quests; kind of get the feeling that he doesn't really have much time. o.O
also imps are really powerful i think everyone would agree to that. i'm not a scripter so i do not know what the coding would be like. *computer stupid here*. to make a time delay on ressing or more stat loss for that specific pet.
Question +Veritas do you get paid for working here? if not than thank you for everything. if so well....ermm.... burning daylight :O

[fingers]

I like the turn this is taking! Obv. a leash for biopets would prevent alot of going wild stuff (therefore why I find the going wild thing unfair) and double good shot if we get youngs a new way of gathering gold.

Funny enough, I complain alot about nerfs, but the 4 changes that I feel are the most needed to balance this place are nerfs:

1. Cap bandages time to 3-4 seconds
2. Bring lady mel @ par with other peerless bosses
3. Give (a lot of) punch to doom gauntlet bosses. At least to bring them at par with lady mel, travesty and Grizzle, who melee hit for 90-150.
4. Limit Ed rewards to easthetical-housing rewards (house slots, deco, dye tubs, cool ethy mounts, yes/skill balls, relayers, +10 levels, no).

And an upgrade: enchanted apples to counter mortal spamming monsters in Sgail and in PVPdung

[anarchy]

for the nerfs

cap bandies--i'll vote no, some people worked hard to achieve 220 dex. *loss of players*
bring lady me---i'll vote no, they tried that was horrible you remember the wait.
give punch to doom--- yes. always though doom monsters in the rooms were too easy. make em all proxies. that would be cool. no sarcasm in last statement.
limit eds rewards-- vote no: that's what makes this game so interesting is the customization. everyone differs in what is the best gear so they re layer to what they think. it makes it like house customization for people that love deco. i love the different combinations. so do others. +10 level deed i would agree on, as there are no need really for it. would greatly improve the market for weapons. not too many weapons have 545 points total. now that i think of it maybe take re layers out. you know how much that would improve the cost of my gear. or do you mean take everyone's re layers away? how many people would quit due to that. o.O hehehe that would be crazy one down, how many to go. hahaha i just realized the title of the post. :O i'm sorry i just thought that was kind of funny. ah well.

[Reese]

How many people believe that the Admins/GMs think we hold onto too much gold? They are always talking about pulling gold from the economy, from Auctions and raffles. Very few items are worth large amounts of gold.

I do not get the pages saying i lost my bio pet so i don't know how often this happens.

+V goes back into history and realizes that "pets weren't fed, or not stabled".

Reese goes back "player spends 110 EDs" 100 to go back 10 to recover, not sure if each armour/equipment = 10 eds but Hey its a solution to the lost my bio pet problem.

What? there is a lost bio pets area??
Awesome that means if the Admins/GMs wanted to do the "remove gold from economy thing" and players wanted to get their "not fed, not stabled" bio back then i suggest a stone like a corpse retrieval or pet summoning stone for pets that go into this "lost pet area".
Currently cost 110 eds to recover a bio. Even at 45k gold each thats 4,950,000 gp
How much time does it take from +Colibri to go back and find these pets?
The Stone will save +Colibri alot of time and post like these will be a thing of the past.

[fingers]

for the nerfs

cap bandies--i'll vote no, some people worked hard to achieve 220 dex. *loss of players*
bring lady me---i'll vote no, they tried that was horrible you remember the wait.
give punch to doom--- yes. always though doom monsters in the rooms were too easy. make em all proxies. that would be cool. no sarcasm in last statement.
limit eds rewards-- vote no: that's what makes this game so interesting is the customization. everyone differs in what is the best gear so they re layer to what they think. it makes it like house customization for people that love deco. i love the different combinations. so do others. +10 level deed i would agree on, as there are no need really for it. would greatly improve the market for weapons. not too many weapons have 545 points total. now that i think of it maybe take re layers out. you know how much that would improve the cost of my gear. or do you mean take everyone's re layers away? how many people would quit due to that. o.O hehehe that would be crazy one down, how many to go. hahaha i just realized the title of the post. :O i'm sorry i just thought that was kind of funny. ah well.

For me, insta bandages + good connection = god mode. On EA servers, cap is at 4 seconds. Bandages can be put on the run and are hardly disruptible. I say that capping the heal timer at 3 seconds would still benefit alot the players who invested in their 220 dex suit.

I would be curious to see the kill stats for peerless bosses. I wouldn't be surprised if for 1 paroxysmus kill, there were hundreds of lady me kills. Nevertheless, the loot is about the same, 'cept that I beleive parox doesnt drop his lard and doesn't drop imp pets. Other than for the GoC item, there is 0 reason to do paroxysmus as it is: it is located way further, one needs to collect keys including brain that hardly drops, and it's a really hard challenge considering his 2000+ breath damage and the fact that he spawns artic ogre lords, orc brutes and others all over the place. I am talking balance here.

I was not thinking of taking away the relayers from players already having them but to make ingame activities the way to go to get them (either an insane amount of gold or tokens to get one).

* For the record I do have 220 dex+, my pets kill lady mel in under 1 minute and i run all doom gauntlet rooms in 6 minutes or less. I am not interested in changes that would give me an advantage, but rather looking for changes that would balance difficulty levels and take away hunting bottlenecks.

[Reese]

When you say Balance sides, are you referring to those who have and those who have not?
Taking the perks of high stats from the people with them to balance out those who don't, seems alot more like the US government. Take away from the people with the stats high enough to heal in 1 second and make it to where they can only heal as fast as someone without 220 dex. OK tax me more cause i have a job to cover the taxes for people without jobs.
One of the perks of playing for a long amount of time is the Stats and Skills and Techniques you obtain or learn during the process. If you tell me today that in a day or a month from now I wont be able to use what i have spent time and money on then don't expect to see much of either one from me.

Suggestion: When considering "Nerfing" something, ask alot of what if's?

Example: Balrons over and over and over give alot of gold. Put in the work get the reward. Some people like myself used to make alot of gold from the Peerless Dungeons. Let me explain why I prefer Peerlass over Balrons. I get bored really easy, after the first 10 balrons i want to do something different. Peerless dungeons provided this. If i get bored in one dungeons i can goto another and see/kill different monsters.
Keep changing stuff, you can obviously see its all working out for the best.
Then again who's best are you looking out for?

In a world where everyone is created equal, and allowed the ability to progress, they are in control of themselves. If they choose not to raise dex to 220 or do GoC quest or not feed pets no body will force them. We can strongly suggest something over and but you can lead a horse to water, can't make it drink.

Obviously its all gotten Off Topic.

So back on Topic
Has Anyone noticed a Human bio losing loyalty faster than non-Human?

+Veritas, can you or someone from the Excelsior staff answer these 2 Qs?
Do the same rules apply on here as OSI/EA with Taming/Lore and Loyalty?
Do the amount of followers make them lose Loyalty faster?

[fingers]

When you say Balance sides, are you referring to those who have and those who have not?

Not at all Reese

1. I am talking balance in strenght of the monsters vs reward: Two peerless bosses offering comparable loot should have comparable difficulty level (ie: paroxysmus vs lady mel). Six minutes in doom gauntlet (25k+ arties+ tons of tokens) should not reward more than one hour gathering keys for paroxysmus + 30 minutes fighting him and rezzing your pets.

2. I am talking balance between skills: While magery, chiv and cleric heals are capped by faster casting / faster casting recovery, there is no cap to healing speed.

3. I am talking balance between pets: a 10 mil+ bio being unshrikable, taking 3 slots, dealing alot less damage than a pack of imps or nobles, costing 10 powders to move around fel and easily going while VS 1 mil imps taking 1 slot, that you shrink and that kills at lightning speed.

[fingers]

Hehehe! News----> Shogall was on this morning asking for a trade 120 anat 120 fish and 1 mil vs a bio pet. I traded. I think she is happy